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The Truth About Socialism

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No one called you a commie, you will have to suffer the anguish of martyrdom some other day.

No, you just said I have commies under my bed and next will tell me to go check my closet with a flashlight and see it's all a bad dream.

Get over yourself, I'm not suffering in the bit. I'm actually living quite a happy and productive life.

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You said that socialism is a branch of communisim. I said communism is a branch of socialism. Your own definition just said I'm right. It's not arrogance on my part when you didn't bother to read your own links. The lady who posted above was under Communisit Russia and no one said that was good. I didn't say it was good but you keep implying I did so I wonder if you even read what I'm posting. There are more socialist countries than communist nations that exist today. You're trying to confuse what is pure socialism and what we have in most countries.

Peaches, nobody is arguing that there is a difference between communist Russia and socialism or that there are more socialistic countries out there today than communist. One of the points is that there is no socialistic model in place that works well in any country. Another point is that we are being pushed into giving up our rights and freedom to chose. When a government is taking control of its citizen's choices, it becomes a totalitarian state. History proves it doesn't work well at all. I have posted about living under communism so you can get an idea what it's like when your government takes complete control under the promise of socialistic reform. And because I hear daily the same regurgitated information that I did growing up. Only things that are different would be that they are spoken in English, in United States and those who say it swear up and down that it is not and never will be called "communism".

 

A very concerning part is that it's not limited to turning United States into a socialistic country.

 

Below quoted from https://www.dsausa.org/about-us/what-is-democratic-socialism/

"Social democratic reform must now happen at the international level. Multinational corporations must be brought under democratic controls, and workers’ organizing efforts must reach across borders."

 

And here is another quote, that strangely resembles the principle of communism when it came to enticing people into believing that all people are going to be equal:

"Although a long-term goal of socialism is to eliminate all but the most enjoyable kinds of labor, we recognize that unappealing jobs will long remain. These tasks would be spread among as many people as possible rather than distributed on the basis of class, race, ethnicity, or gender, as they are under capitalism. And this undesirable work should be among the best, not the least, rewarded work within the economy."

 

So in other words, what they propose is that a doctor will be getting paid as much as a fast food worker and both are going to enjoy it because it's rewarded socially and economically, same benefits and all. Oh and eventually no matter what kind of a job you decide to get, you'll be getting up every morning for work singing like the dwarfs in Snow White and hopping along happily while you also enjoy your communal living.

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As I have told you many times, mechanical engineering is one of my many skills, and I do own a company that provides those and other services. But it's hardly my only area of expertise. More importantly, I own multiple businesses. So another failed attempt from you to try and discredit me.

 

The "nonsense" I posted was well supported by multiple links. Links that I'm quite sure you did not bother to read. The one about macroeconomics is likely over your head, anyway.

 

 

LOL. I do love you, my friend!

You're a mechanical engineer? Im so sorry because I thought you said you were a science major because our past conversations were about global warming. Did you go to Southern Poly (now KSU) or GA Tech? I got accepted at Tech but decided I didn't want downtown and I really wanted a smaller school. Is that where you got the economics classes or did you do the GA State partnership for the economics? My sister-in-law got her PhD from GA Tech in biomolecular engineering. It's a great school.

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You're a mechanical engineer? Im so sorry because I thought you said you were a science major because our past conversations were about global warming. Did you go to Southern Poly (now KSU) or GA Tech? I got accepted at Tech but decided I didn't want downtown and I really wanted a smaller school. Is that where you got the economics classes or did you do the GA State partnership for the economics? My sister-in-law got her PhD from GA Tech in biomolecular engineering. It's a great school.

I have many skills. And your reading comprehension is kinda lacking.

 

But since you're just trying to redirect because you can't refute my claims, I will ignore the rest of your post.

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....GA Tech..... It's a great school.

 

I think this is the very first thing you have ever posted that I agree with.

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I have many skills. And your reading comprehension is kinda lacking.

 

But since you're just trying to redirect because you can't refute my claims, I will ignore the rest of your post.

I wasn't redirecting anything and you're being really rude.

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I wasn't redirecting anything and you're being really rude.

What do you call your last post? It was also an attempt to discredit me.

 

You haven't posted the first support of your claims; you've only said I am wrong and tried to discredit me.

 

I think this is the very first thing you have ever posted that I agree with.

Hey, we all make mistakes, even her.

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What do you call your last post? It was also an attempt to discredit me.

 

You haven't posted the first support of your claims; you've only said I am wrong and tried to discredit me.

Hey, we all make mistakes, even her.

Excuse me but how am I trying to discredit you in anything I've posted? I said that there are many socialist countries that are doing very well and that no socialist country has ever then become communist like you said. I don't see how that is discrediting you but I am challenging you on that and the fact that there is not only one form of socialism. My other point is that communism is a form of socialism whereas you said socialism is a form of communism. None of that warranted you being rude.

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Excuse me but how am I trying to discredit you in anything I've posted? I said that there are many socialist countries that are doing very well and that no socialist country has ever then become communist like you said. I don't see how that is discrediting you but I am challenging you on that and the fact that there is not only one form of socialism. My other point is that communism is a form of socialism whereas you said socialism is a form of communism. None of that warranted you being rude.

The snide remarks about my education/qualifications.

 

That had zero bearing on this discussion.

 

BTW...I never said Socialism is a form of Communism, I said it was a component of it.

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The snide remarks about my education/qualifications.

 

That had zero bearing on this discussion.

 

BTW...I never said Socialism is a form of Communism, I said it was a component of it.

I'm sorry but I'm lost here. You said you had a background in mechanical engineering and I said I thought you had a science degree, so obviously I was mistaken. I apoligizefor my mistake. You did say socialism is a component of communism and I said that communism is a componet of socialism, and is just one of many forms fo socialism. Give me examples of socialist countries that failed. You're being very rude when you said I had reading comprehension problems.

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Also....there are variations on Socialism, but the basic tenants are always the same. And it will not work for any long period of time. Proponents keep trying over and over, and it fails over and over.

Socialism is at odds with human nature. It prevents the very motivations that make us want to grow and excel, to better ourselves.

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Also....there are variations on Socialism, but the basic tenants are always the same. And it will not work for any long period of time. Proponents keep trying over and over, and it fails over and over.

 

Socialism is at odds with human nature. It prevents the very motivations that make us want to grow and excel, to better ourselves.

The basic tenent is not the same in each form. That's what I'm tryign to get you to see. Are you saying that we should fight to squash socialism in all forms because it is against human nature?

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The basic tenent is not the same in each form. That's what I'm tryign to get you to see. Are you saying that we should fight to squash socialism in all forms because it is against human nature?

Please explain how the basic tenants are different.

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It's like watching a train wreck in slow-mo.

 

 

c35.gif

Yes, that's a good way to describe Socialism. The people of Venezuella would probably agree with you.

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What do you call your last post? It was also an attempt to discredit me.

 

You haven't posted the first support of your claims; you've only said I am wrong and tried to discredit me.

Hey, we all make mistakes, even her.

You discredit yourself, you don't need any help.

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Two things Americans should fight... Socialism and fascism.

 

- Jamie

Glad to see you included fascism, the right wing form of totalitarianism.

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You discredit yourself, you don't need any help.

Personal attack with zero relevant information. As usual.

 

As I have already pointed out, I'm the one here who has posted multiple links to support my claims. None of you from the left have posted any support whatsoever; all you've done is to say I'm wrong and make personal attacks.

 

But that's typical for your bunch.

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Because "Socialism". Because who's going to pay the bills when the middle class collapses? You end up with two classes, those that have money and those that don't.

What people don't understand is Socialism doesn't take from the rich and give to the poor. Socialism takes from the working class and gives to the poor. The rich stay rich, the working class works themselves into being poor by allowing the government (the rich) to tax them into poverty.

So basically the United States is a socialist country where the middle class spends the time It is not working defending the policies that allow the rich to remain rich or become richer while the middle class works harder to not get ahead. Or so it sounds from this post (except the part about defending policies - that is based strictly on what takes place all over the internet on a daily basis).

Edited by rednekkhikkchikk

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So basically the United States is a socialist country where the middle class spends the time It is not working defending the policies that allow the rich to remain rich or become richer while the middle class works harder to not get ahead. Or so it sounds from this post (except the part about defending policies - that is based strictly on what takes place all over the internet on a daily basis).

That's not true at all.

 

The United States is a constitutional republic. Our constitution calls for a few items that some might call Socialist; common defense, interstate commerce, etc; but they really aren't. While we do have some Socialist elements in our country, they were added over time by congress, and many of our problems can be traced directly back to these elements.

 

Regarding monetary classes; one of the beauties of the United States is that any one of us have the opportunity to become one of the rich is we work hard and make smart decisions. That is part of the American Dream we've always heard about.

 

In spite of all the envy talk and class warfare from certain groups; the rich pay the vast majority of taxes in our country. The Office of Management and Budget says that the top 20% of wage earners in our country pay 95% of the taxes. I realize this doesn't go with the liberal narrative, but it's the truth. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/omb-top-20-pay-95-of-taxes-middle-class-single-digits

 

Even the lower income here have a better standard of living than most of the people in the world, other developed nations included.

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That's not true at all.

 

The United States is a constitutional republic. Our constitution calls for a few items that some might call Socialist; common defense, interstate commerce, etc; but they really aren't. While we do have some Socialist elements in our country, they were added over time by congress, and many of our problems can be traced directly back to these elements.

 

Regarding monetary classes; one of the beauties of the United States is that any one of us have the opportunity to become one of the rich is we work hard and make smart decisions. That is part of the American Dream we've always heard about.

 

In spite of all the envy talk and class warfare from certain groups; the rich pay the vast majority of taxes in our country. The Office of Management and Budget says that the top 20% of wage earners in our country pay 95% of the taxes. I realize this doesn't go with the liberal narrative, but it's the truth. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/omb-top-20-pay-95-of-taxes-middle-class-single-digits

 

Even the lower income here have a better standard of living than most of the people in the world, other developed nations included.

 

Blah, blah, blah... Socialize the debt and privatize the profits. When this country goes to war for corporate interests, what percentage of blood do the top 20% sacrifice on the front lines?

Edited by COWA

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Blah, blah, blah... Social the debt and privatize the profits. When this country goes to war for corporate interests, what percentage of blood do the top 20% sacrifice on the front lines?

That's a dumb question, most of the wealthy are too old to serve. If the draft was ever reinstated, I'm sure some of the affluent young would go.

 

But the truth is, the rich pay the vast majority of the cost or war. Some of them produce the weaponry and related equipment.

 

They are doing their fair share.

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This thread is about as interesting as watching paint peel off a fence post.

Then why are you reading it?

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That's a dumb question, most of the wealthy are too old to serve. If the draft was ever reinstated, I'm sure some of the affluent young would go.

 

But the truth is, the rich pay the vast majority of the cost or war. Some of them produce the weaponry and related equipment.

 

They are doing their fair share.

 

What's the value of live's lost for someone else's war profiteering? Name some affluent youth that have died in a war. I bet the percentages are well below 1%. There aren't any named Trump or Romney in modern history.

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Regarding monetary classes; one of the beauties of the United States is that any one of us have the opportunity to become one of the rich is we work hard and make smart decisions. That is part of the American Dream we've always heard about.

 

So True!

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What's the value of live's lost for someone else's war profiteering? Name some affluent youth that have died in a war. I bet the percentages are well below 1%. There aren't any named Trump or Romney in modern history.

Potentially good discussion, but please start a separate thread for it.

 

Thanks

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As I read this, it is so clear that we'd be living on Mars would have colonized the solar system if we just hadn't gone down the road of socialism with passage of child labor laws.

 

How could we so foolish as to restrict the ability of the ultra rich to use the right-sized hands and lack of brains of six and seven year old children.

 

In terms of social morale, we all know that we are all so grandly inspired when our contemporaries are killed, maimed and ultimately starved if they make a mistake like getting sick or having an industrial accident. Think of the billions wasted on regulations that require things like breathing apparatus in mines not to mention how avoiding mine disasters dooms workers to the much more painful death from black lung. I mean it can be such a waste, spending money on such mundane things as safety if it gets in the way of the special people making more money. No one I know begrudges John D. Rockefeller the penny he had a history of giving to the street urchins who begged.

 

As far as medical care, we know that 75 percent of the money spent on health care is spent in the last two weeks of life so what we need to do is cut all health care insurance for any critical medical care situation that may end in death. We will really cut our health care costs fulfilling Donald Trumps' promise of low cost health care ... and if a condition is not critical or life threatening, we can even afford to cover it.

 

What we in the GOP are offering is a candy-cane wonderful world where all is hunky dory and, yes, perfect; even in its failures which we make sure you don't know about or hear about making, nay proving, the fact that a falling tree makes no noise in the woods is no one is allowed to hear it.

 

Yea, and those evil enemies of the people who try ... and they are all failing (we know that because DJT says they are failing) to disrupt our perfect world and make all the bad stuff that we're pulling a matter of public record. Well, folks you have a choice, a public record or a fantasy where everything is perfect. It is a choice... Vote Republican, lay back and take another oxy and, take GD's and zorro and cptlo and rhett's word for it - all is as it should be ... which is victims ought to be happy victims and if you follow their lead, you can die with a smile on your face.

 

pubby

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As I read this, it is so clear that we'd be living on Mars would have colonized the solar system if we just hadn't gone down the road of socialism with passage of child labor laws.

 

How could we so foolish as to restrict the ability of the ultra rich to use the right-sized hands and lack of brains of six and seven year old children.

 

In terms of social morale, we all know that we are all so grandly inspired when our contemporaries are killed, maimed and ultimately starved if they make a mistake like getting sick or having an industrial accident. Think of the billions wasted on regulations that require things like breathing apparatus in mines not to mention how avoiding mine disasters dooms workers to the much more painful death from black lung. I mean it can be such a waste, spending money on such mundane things as safety if it gets in the way of the special people making more money. No one I know begrudges John D. Rockefeller the penny he had a history of giving to the street urchins who begged.

 

As far as medical care, we know that 75 percent of the money spent on health care is spent in the last two weeks of life so what we need to do is cut all health care insurance for any critical medical care situation that may end in death. We will really cut our health care costs fulfilling Donald Trumps' promise of low cost health care ... and if a condition is not critical or life threatening, we can even afford to cover it.

 

What we in the GOP are offering is a candy-cane wonderful world where all is hunky dory and, yes, perfect; even in its failures which we make sure you don't know about or hear about making, nay proving, the fact that a falling tree makes no noise in the woods is no one is allowed to hear it.

 

Yea, and those evil enemies of the people who try ... and they are all failing (we know that because DJT says they are failing) to disrupt our perfect world and make all the bad stuff that we're pulling a matter of public record. Well, folks you have a choice, a public record or a fantasy where everything is perfect. It is a choice... Vote Republican, lay back and take another oxy and, take GD's and zorro and cptlo and rhett's word for it - all is as it should be ... which is victims ought to be happy victims and if you follow their lead, you can die with a smile on your face.

 

pubby

 

Cliff notes?

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Cliff notes?

 

 

The GOP position is predators are predators and ought to be allowed to be the best predators they can be while democrats are victims and victims need to know that their role is very important to the predators but they should just man up and quit their bitching.

 

The result may be a fantasy world but hey, the predators have their gold-plated toilets and fixtures and as far as the victims ... they all die anyway in the end so why can't we get along?

 

pubby

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Cliff notes?

I'll translate for you...

 

"We need government to do everything for us. Neither individuals nor private business is capable of accomplishing anything good, only government can do that. Government must take care of us and nurture us. Only government can spend money properly. Government is our mother once we exit the womb. Government, government, government. Oh and, only Democratic government."

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I'll translate for you...

 

"We need government to do everything for us. Neither individuals nor private business is capable of accomplishing anything good, only government can do that. Government must take care of us and nurture us. Only government can spend money properly. Government is our mother once we exit the womb. Government, government, government. Oh and, only Democratic government."

 

Don't you mean that Republicans need government to do nothing because republicans like Brian Kemp need those jobs 'doing nothing' because they're so incompetent. Then with full knowledge and support from Republican voters for them doing nothing (a great job) those other Republicans who are predators can take extra from the victims and keep subsidizing elected Republican officials for turning a blind eye to their predatory extractions.

 

Now that we've formed international criminal syndicates with such visionary leaders as Vlad Putin organizing the predation, we especially want small, weak governments everywhere because they're comparably so weak they are incapable of controlling these pedators.

 

What you forget is rats are predators and when the easy sources of food are exhausted the big male rats turn to cannibalism attacking the weakest of their kind.

 

Brings to mind the coat that Melania wore a few months ago ... I don't care, do you?

 

pubby

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