Jump to content
Paulding.com
Sign in to follow this  
michaelsudan

The Beginning of the End for Airport Expansion?

Recommended Posts

Maybe the former commissioners that did this under the table should have to pay for it out of

their pockets. Time to get rid of Austin and his buddies.

post-45888-0-34205600-1454081392_thumb.jpg

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is what I've learned about this 7th grade food fight over the past 2 years.

 

Very few folks have heard of the 10-80-10 rule (different folks tweak these numbers a bit, but the spirit of the theory is the same).

What that means is that with most endeavors, whether it's a business, church, non profit or politician, the following will usually occur.

 

10% of your customers, voters, stakeholders, insert synonym here _______ will love what you're doing, and it is almost impossible to make them hate you. Business classes will instruct you that you should not spend a ton of time and energy "preaching to the choir".

 

10% will hate what you're doing. There will be no converting these folks, there is nothing you can do to bring them over. Business classes will instruct you to not spend time worrying about saving the ones that don't want to be saved.

 

80% of your target market or customers are usually in the middle or are apathetic. This is where you should spend your time and energy.

 

This situation and the warring factions are a prime example of what happens when you do not adhere to this ideology. You surround yourself by airport haters / lovers, and you become convinced that everyone shares your opinion. You obsess over making the other 10% on the far other end of the spectrum come over to your side, and will not accept that it is a statistical certainty that it will never happen.

The folks that get screwed are the people like me, the middle 80% that think that our county will be just fine with or without the airport. I don't think jobs will fall out of the sky, nor do I think planes will fall out of the sky. I don't care about getting revenge on politicians that were voted out of office nearly 2 years ago, nor do I care about "who started it". I know that we have an airport here in the county, and that the final determination about whether or not it will have puddle jumpers or 737's landing on its runway is up to the FAA, not the BOC. I think Paulding will be fine with whatever they decide.

 

I do, however, absolutely resent the anti-airport faction as well as the Let Paulding Fly folks for making us look like ass hats for the past 2 years. There are ways to disagree politically without embarrassing the middle 80% of the county that does not wake up every morning and check Facebook to see if there is any new airport drama. We now only nominate and vote for post commissioners based on 1 issue. We've become a single issue county, when there are other far more important issues that need to be addressed. I've spent a lot of time listening to both sides speak at meetings, read their blogs, Facebook pages and listened to them in public. I want absolutely nothing to do with either side. I've never seen this level of obsession, paranoia, bitterness, pissing, moaning and belly aching about a political matter that, after it runs its course, will not have nearly the dramatic effect feared / promised by either side. Even if it does, the thrill of one side's victory in this battle will be long forgotten due to the wounds of the war, which will be around after most of us have either died or left this county.

On behalf of the middle 80%, thank you for making our county a joke.

 

Both sides now are rushing to blame the other as to who we should blame for the $400,000 pile of __________ we are about to eat. I'll save both sides time. We blame you BOTH. You both created this situation, now it's gotten out of control and you are both wanting to point fingers. Grow up, both of you. Look in the mirror, and ask if it was worth it. After listening to both sides and seeing their levels of absolute obsession, I know that both sides are too far gone to have any self accountability whatsoever. Sleep tight, blame someone else. We blame you both.

 

Let's see who the first person is to reply and lecture me on "who started it" and why I should care about their side more, or mock me for not agreeing with their opinion, which they have confused with being gospel. I'll make it easy for you, most of us don't spend a ton of time obsessing over who started it and quite frankly don't care. We just want to move forward, preferably without suing your own damn county.

Edited by Newbie in New Hope
  • Like 6

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe the former commissioners that did this under the table should have to pay for it out of

their pockets. Time to get rid of Austin and his buddies.

Absolutely, they should!!! Just like Jerry Shearin and the Builders of Palisades subdivision should have to pay Surepip (The Morrison's) what they were suing the County for, for taking what was theirs and legal fees!!! The Tax Payers SHOULD NOT HAVE TO FOOT THE BILL FOR THESE GREEDY COMMISSIONERS AND BUILDERS/AIRPORT PEOPLE!!!

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wrong Austin and his buddies started it by doing everything under the table. It was

voted down twice, but they did it anyway. The blame needs to fall on the people that did

this when it was not wanted. You may be one of the 80%, but I believe it is more

likely 80% against. Why did they (austin and friends) do this under the table?

post-45888-0-67716700-1454095638_thumb.jpg

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course radiohead, both sides are convinced that most of the county agrees with them. Most of the folks in NE Paulding don't even know there is an airport, could care less about it and think of themselves as being in Acworth more than they do Yorkville. Never mind that they pay a lion's share of the taxes and will need to take the $400,000 bath along with everyone else. You think there are more of you because you've surrounded yourself by like minded people (like we all do, that's not a pot shot). I talk to dozens of people in this county every day that is very much a true random sample (not folks at Chamber meetings or anti airport rallies). When I mention the airport, most either don't know about it, or roll their eyes and say that they just want this to be over.

 

Do you really think Paulding is the first county on earth that had to live or die by the decisions that prior BOC's, city councils, Congress / Senates, Presidents tried when they were in office? The "revenge" is to vote them out, which everyone did. But that wasn't enough, you guys needed your revenge.

The other side doubled down as well, making out everyone that didn't agree with them sound like "shut ins" or cooks. I've never seen such animosity between folks that are neighbors over political matters.

 

I've lived in counties and towns where something like this has come up before (believe it or not, similar issues have arisen before and the sun still came up the next day). The difference was the tone of the discourse. I saw 2 city councilman debate back and forth over whether some gigantic "job machine" should be built in their peaceful county. When a citizen came up and started attacking them personally, but politicians who were just debating each other, stopped the person and made statements such as "this is simply a political disagreement, Bob, Chuck Whoever is a good man and we are not going to stand here and let you attack him personally. If you have a policy disagreement, please continue". We don't see that here. We see, "if you're friends with or agree with ________________, you must be in his back pocket, you must be a crook, you must be getting paid by Delta". It's immature and beneath all of you. It's embarrassing. Please stop embarrassing us any further.

 

There are more of us than there are of any of you on either side. Just look at the voter turnout for county only elections. That shows how absolutely apathetic most of this county is on this issue.

 

This county has grown nearly 350% since 1990 (around 40,000 in 1990, 142,000 in 2010). That means the VAST majority of this county was not born here, does not care who's grandpa these roads were named after, and don't care about how peaceful the woods were in 1980. I'm not saying that's right, it just is. To pretend that most of this county agrees with you, for either side, is simply naïve or arrogant.

Edited by Newbie in New Hope
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here is what I've learned about this 7th grade food fight over the past 2 years.

 

Very few folks have heard of the 10-80-10 rule (different folks tweak these numbers a bit, but the spirit of the theory is the same).

What that means is that with most endeavors, whether it's a business, church, non profit or politician, the following will usually occur.

 

10% of your customers, voters, stakeholders, insert synonym here _______ will love what you're doing, and it is almost impossible to make them hate you. Business classes will instruct you that you should not spend a ton of time and energy "preaching to the choir".

 

10% will hate what you're doing. There will be no converting these folks, there is nothing you can do to bring them over. Business classes will instruct you to not spend time worrying about saving the ones that don't want to be saved.

 

80% of your target market or customers are usually in the middle or are apathetic. This is where you should spend your time and energy.

 

This situation and the warring factions are a prime example of what happens when you do not adhere to this ideology. You surround yourself by airport haters / lovers, and you become convinced that everyone shares your opinion. You obsess over making the other 10% on the far other end of the spectrum come over to your side, and will not accept that it is a statistical certainty that it will never happen.

 

The folks that get screwed are the people like me, the middle 80% that think that our county will be just fine with or without the airport. I don't think jobs will fall out of the sky, nor do I think planes will fall out of the sky. I don't care about getting revenge on politicians that were voted out of office nearly 2 years ago, nor do I care about "who started it". I know that we have an airport here in the county, and that the final determination about whether or not it will have puddle jumpers or 737's landing on its runway is up to the FAA, not the BOC. I think Paulding will be fine with whatever they decide.

 

I do, however, absolutely resent the anti-airport faction as well as the Let Paulding Fly folks for making us look like ass hats for the past 2 years. There are ways to disagree politically without embarrassing the middle 80% of the county that does not wake up every morning and check Facebook to see if there is any new airport drama. We now only nominate and vote for post commissioners based on 1 issue. We've become a single issue county, when there are other far more important issues that need to be addressed. I've spent a lot of time listening to both sides speak at meetings, read their blogs, Facebook pages and listened to them in public. I want absolutely nothing to do with either side. I've never seen this level of obsession, paranoia, bitterness, pissing, moaning and belly aching about a political matter that, after it runs its course, will not have nearly the dramatic effect feared / promised by either side. Even if it does, the thrill of one side's victory in this battle will be long forgotten due to the wounds of the war, which will be around after most of us have either died or left this county.

On behalf of the middle 80%, thank you for making our county a joke.

 

Both sides now are rushing to blame the other as to who we should blame for the $400,000 pile of __________ we are about to eat. I'll save both sides time. We blame you BOTH. You both created this situation, now it's gotten out of control and you are both wanting to point fingers. Grow up, both of you. Look in the mirror, and ask if it was worth it. After listening to both sides and seeing their levels of absolute obsession, I know that both sides are too far gone to have any self accountability whatsoever. Sleep tight, blame someone else. We blame you both.

 

Let's see who the first person is to reply and lecture me on "who started it" and why I should care about their side more, or mock me for not agreeing with their opinion, which they have confused with being gospel. I'll make it easy for you, most of us don't spend a ton of time obsessing over who started it and quite frankly don't care. We just want to move forward, preferably without suing your own damn county.

 

 

:clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping: :clapping:

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just my opinion, yours may differ.

This is a long post for two reasons, one, I am long winded, two, is is not a quick sound bite issue, despite what social media (including me) would make it look like.

 

Ahhhh the airport.

That grand old place that brings people together and heals all wounds.

Ok, maybe that is a bit of a stretch.

To discuss the airport situation logically, you have to break it down into parts.

There is the general aviation airport before, and after, the commercialization deal.

There is the commercialization deal, the way it was handled in the beginning and the way it is being handled in the present.

There is the anti commercialization part, including the law suits.

There is the who is "causing all the problems".

Then there is the, where do we go from here and how do we resolve this problem.

 

1. General aviation - I was told by Mr. Swafford, personally, that as far as someone working for Paulding County is concerned, that the burden of selling our airport to general aviation business was Jamie Gilbert's responsibility, that is until he resigned.

According to what Mr. Swafford told me, that responsibility then fell on his shoulders.

I presume that it is now the responsibility of the person that was hired to fill Mr. Gilbert's position.

No matter how you slice it, the job has not been done well.

In my opinion, until someone is hired, that is experienced in general aviation airports and selling general aviation airports, to work full time on doing nothing but selling our general aviation airport, then the job will never be done well.

This is not an attack or a slap at those who have tried to do the job in the past, or are currently tasked with doing that job, if anyone actually is.

Is is just a fact.

You cannot effectively sell what you do not have detailed knowledge about, you cannot effectively sell something when you do not know the market and/or the players that are potential customers, and in this case, that includes the whole country.

This is the one thing about the airport situation that makes me the maddest.

No matter what is happening or what happens in the future with the commercial issue, this is an area that our county does have control over and that we can and should (for 6-7 yrs we should have been) be taking the steps necessary to make it a success.

 

2. Commercialization of the airport

a. In general - My personal opinion is that I do not have a problem with the idea of having commercial, passenger, 139, flights at the Paulding county airport.

However, like anything else that can have a major, long term effect, both good and bad, on the people in the county, extreme due diligence must be done before moving forward in getting a 139 certificate, as that certificate cannot just be "turned back in" and things go back to the way it was before it was granted.

You are putting this county on the hook, for many many years to come, so you need to have the best business plan that you can have, before you apply for the 139 certificate.

Since Mr. Swafford told me personally, that the airport has "no business plan" for general aviation, I have cannot believe that they have a plan for commercialization, other than the deal with Propeller.

That, to me, is a major concern.

b. The way it was handled in the beginning and in the present - I don't think there is a single person that does not think that this issue could have been handled better at the beginning of the commercialization deal.

It was keep secret from a commissioner, who's district the airport is in, it has been surrounded by misinformation, half truths, unwise things said by our leaders in the heat of the moment and in general, just about as mishandled as it could be.

Basically, if you wanted to handle this issue wrong, you probably couldn't have mishandled it as badly as it has been handled.

Again, this is my opinion, then by the time the "dust had cleared", people had hunkered down in their respective positions and they by god, are not going to budge an inch. (I am including all sides in that statement)

And that is kinda where we are at the present.

So much of this has been based on who is friends with who, who likes who, who goes to church with who and things along those lines.

I have to wonder how this would have turned out, had when this originally started, if there had been a big announcement from our leaders, explaining the deal and what the upside for the county was. Perhaps had some local meetings where the people from Propeller came in and gave a presentation and answered questions.

Would everyone have been happy and on board?

Of course not, but maybe, just maybe, it might have gone better.

A personal note, I have personally had a meeting with Tod Pownell, Blake Swafford and David Carmichael, I have also met, but did not have a meeting, with Vernon Collett and Tony Crowe.

I found all these men to be polite, nice and as far as I could tell, sincere.

I also wish to say that while I feel that rules have been very seriously bent, if not broken, and that things have been done "behind the scenes" and not done in the manner they should have and that some people (not any of those mentioned above) have abused the authority of their position, until someone shows me evidence and proof, I have no reason to think that anyone, currently in the Paulding county government, is a "crook".

c. The lawsuits - I have no issue with the lawsuits against the AA and the building authority. (they are not against the county of Paulding) That is the people's right to sue.

Who's paying the lawyers? None of my business.

I've said it before and I will say it again, if it is Delta, then Paulding better get ready, cause that wait and run them out of money tactic ain't gonna work on Delta. Paulding will be broke before Delta.

Get in the courtroom and get the lawsuits resolved.

That is the bottom line on the lawsuits.

You can complain and whine, on either side, but the lawsuits ain't just going away because a family had health issues and ran out of money.

They are not going away until the case is heard in court.

So let's get it done and quit stalling till the elections turn out the way "you" want.

d. Who's causing all the problems - Now this is an interesting one.

I always look at who started the ball rolling, so in this case, given everything that happened and the way it, in the beginning, I would say that our BOC, the AA started the "problem" ball rolling.

They compounded those problems by not acknowledging them and addressing them and quite frankly, apologizing (where needed) and trying to correct those problems.

Then, it became personal and we are still there.

So now it feeds off itself.

The county is like an old married couple that has it's fighting routine down to an art.

The couple may start out disagreeing over what TV show to watch, but very quickly they start doing the "fight dance", where every past step and turn is automatic, they don't even have to think about it.

My opinion, it will take years and years for these wounds to heal, but I hope I am proven wrong.

 

3. Where do we go from here and how do we resolve this problem

Now, if I truly had the answers to this question, don't you think I would have already solved this crises and be working on peace in the middle east.

Get the lawsuits into court and resolved.

Stop putting personal issues ahead of county issues.

Operate county business and do things in the open, be like the queen, "not even the appearance of impropriety".

Compromise. I had a situation with a customer where both of us felt like we were in the right. We met, put aside who was wrong and concentrated on getting the problem resolved. At the end, we had an agreement that neither of us liked, but both of us could live with.

I made the comment that, "We must have done this as fair as possible, because neither is happy, but both can live with the resolution." My customer thought a minute and said, "You know, your right."

So put aside your.....testosterone levels (cleaned that one up) and compromise where possible.

Quit thinking that just because you like someone, that they can't have screwed up or made a mistake or are wrong about something.

Saying that a person made a mistake is not a betrayal of that person or their friendship.

EVERYONE makes mistakes, some of us make the same ones over and over.

 

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

(unless it benefits me to change it, then try not to get caught in the whiplash of my changing)

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just my opinion, yours may differ.

This is a long post for two reasons, one, I am long winded, two, is is not a quick sound bite issue, despite what social media (including me) would make it look like.

 

Ahhhh the airport.

That grand old place that brings people together and heals all wounds.

Ok, maybe that is a bit of a stretch.

To discuss the airport situation logically, you have to break it down into parts.

There is the general aviation airport before, and after, the commercialization deal.

There is the commercialization deal, the way it was handled in the beginning and the way it is being handled in the present.

There is the anti commercialization part, including the law suits.

There is the who is "causing all the problems".

Then there is the, where do we go from here and how do we resolve this problem.

 

1. General aviation - I was told by Mr. Swafford, personally, that as far as someone working for Paulding County is concerned, that the burden of selling our airport to general aviation business was Jamie Gilbert's responsibility, that is until he resigned.

According to what Mr. Swafford told me, that responsibility then fell on his shoulders.

I presume that it is now the responsibility of the person that was hired to fill Mr. Gilbert's position.

No matter how you slice it, the job has not been done well.

In my opinion, until someone is hired, that is experienced in general aviation airports and selling general aviation airports, to work full time on doing nothing but selling our general aviation airport, then the job will never be done well.

This is not an attack or a slap at those who have tried to do the job in the past, or are currently tasked with doing that job, if anyone actually is.

Is is just a fact.

You cannot effectively sell what you do not have detailed knowledge about, you cannot effectively sell something when you do not know the market and/or the players that are potential customers, and in this case, that includes the whole country.

This is the one thing about the airport situation that makes me the maddest.

No matter what is happening or what happens in the future with the commercial issue, this is an area that our county does have control over and that we can and should (for 6-7 yrs we should have been) be taking the steps necessary to make it a success.

 

2. Commercialization of the airport

a. In general - My personal opinion is that I do not have a problem with the idea of having commercial, passenger, 139, flights at the Paulding county airport.

However, like anything else that can have a major, long term effect, both good and bad, on the people in the county, extreme due diligence must be done before moving forward in getting a 139 certificate, as that certificate cannot just be "turned back in" and things go back to the way it was before it was granted.

You are putting this county on the hook, for many many years to come, so you need to have the best business plan that you can have, before you apply for the 139 certificate.

Since Mr. Swafford told me personally, that the airport has "no business plan" for general aviation, I have cannot believe that they have a plan for commercialization, other than the deal with Propeller.

That, to me, is a major concern.

b. The way it was handled in the beginning and in the present - I don't think there is a single person that does not think that this issue could have been handled better at the beginning of the commercialization deal.

It was keep secret from a commissioner, who's district the airport is in, it has been surrounded by misinformation, half truths, unwise things said by our leaders in the heat of the moment and in general, just about as mishandled as it could be.

Basically, if you wanted to handle this issue wrong, you probably couldn't have mishandled it as badly as it has been handled.

Again, this is my opinion, then by the time the "dust had cleared", people had hunkered down in their respective positions and they by god, are not going to budge an inch. (I am including all sides in that statement)

And that is kinda where we are at the present.

So much of this has been based on who is friends with who, who likes who, who goes to church with who and things along those lines.

I have to wonder how this would have turned out, had when this originally started, if there had been a big announcement from our leaders, explaining the deal and what the upside for the county was. Perhaps had some local meetings where the people from Propeller came in and gave a presentation and answered questions.

Would everyone have been happy and on board?

Of course not, but maybe, just maybe, it might have gone better.

A personal note, I have personally had a meeting with Tod Pownell, Blake Swafford and David Carmichael, I have also met, but did not have a meeting, with Vernon Collett and Tony Crowe.

I found all these men to be polite, nice and as far as I could tell, sincere.

I also wish to say that while I feel that rules have been very seriously bent, if not broken, and that things have been done "behind the scenes" and not done in the manner they should have and that some people (not any of those mentioned above) have abused the authority of their position, until someone shows me evidence and proof, I have no reason to think that anyone, currently in the Paulding county government, is a "crook".

c. The lawsuits - I have no issue with the lawsuits against the AA and the building authority. (they are not against the county of Paulding) That is the people's right to sue.

Who's paying the lawyers? None of my business.

I've said it before and I will say it again, if it is Delta, then Paulding better get ready, cause that wait and run them out of money tactic ain't gonna work on Delta. Paulding will be broke before Delta.

Get in the courtroom and get the lawsuits resolved.

That is the bottom line on the lawsuits.

You can complain and whine, on either side, but the lawsuits ain't just going away because a family had health issues and ran out of money.

They are not going away until the case is heard in court.

So let's get it done and quit stalling till the elections turn out the way "you" want.

d. Who's causing all the problems - Now this is an interesting one.

I always look at who started the ball rolling, so in this case, given everything that happened and the way it, in the beginning, I would say that our BOC, the AA started the "problem" ball rolling.

They compounded those problems by not acknowledging them and addressing them and quite frankly, apologizing (where needed) and trying to correct those problems.

Then, it became personal and we are still there.

So now it feeds off itself.

The county is like an old married couple that has it's fighting routine down to an art.

The couple may start out disagreeing over what TV show to watch, but very quickly they start doing the "fight dance", where every past step and turn is automatic, they don't even have to think about it.

My opinion, it will take years and years for these wounds to heal, but I hope I am proven wrong.

 

3. Where do we go from here and how do we resolve this problem

Now, if I truly had the answers to this question, don't you think I would have already solved this crises and be working on peace in the middle east.

Get the lawsuits into court and resolved.

Stop putting personal issues ahead of county issues.

Operate county business and do things in the open, be like the queen, "not even the appearance of impropriety".

Compromise. I had a situation with a customer where both of us felt like we were in the right. We met, put aside who was wrong and concentrated on getting the problem resolved. At the end, we had an agreement that neither of us liked, but both of us could live with.

I made the comment that, "We must have done this as fair as possible, because neither is happy, but both can live with the resolution." My customer thought a minute and said, "You know, your right."

So put aside your.....testosterone levels (cleaned that one up) and compromise where possible.

Quit thinking that just because you like someone, that they can't have screwed up or made a mistake or are wrong about something.

Saying that a person made a mistake is not a betrayal of that person or their friendship.

EVERYONE makes mistakes, some of us make the same ones over and over.

 

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

(unless it benefits me to change it, then try not to get caught in the whiplash of my changing)

I was with you up until that funny thing you mentioned called "compromise". The last time I heard of any offer of compromise towards the Airport was that "tearful" speech by Todd Pownall that basically said " do it our way and our way only and we'll call it a compromise".

 

Now with that said... I agree with that other poster above, the one from 80%. At this point, who cares who started what, can we get on with it already?! Although, I'm not sure if h/she has ever attend Let Paulding Fly meetings where, BIG SURPRISE! airport is not the main dish on the menu and it's ALL about improving Paulding County starting with those every day concerns of safety, taxation, education, development, you know, the stuff that actually matters. Of course, no conversation I have every started with anti-airport people, no matter how far removed from the topic it was, could be exempted from it being mentioned, dwelled on, bitched about and refused to be steered away from the airport.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was with you up until that funny thing you mentioned called "compromise". The last time I heard of any offer of compromise towards the Airport was that "tearful" speech by Todd Pownall that basically said " do it our way and our way only and we'll call it a compromise".

 

Now with that said... I agree with that other poster above, the one from 80%. At this point, who cares who started what, can we get on with it already?! Although, I'm not sure if h/she has ever attend Let Paulding Fly meetings where, BIG SURPRISE! airport is not the main dish on the menu and it's ALL about improving Paulding County starting with those every day concerns of safety, taxation, education, development, you know, the stuff that actually matters. Of course, no conversation I have every started with anti-airport people, no matter how far removed from the topic it was, could be exempted from it being mentioned, dwelled on, bitched about and refused to be steered away from the airport.

 

We have a different take on that "tearful" speech by Mr. Pownell.

To my knowledge, it was the only time the word was even brought up.

Of course, I may be biased, since it came the same week I spent 30 minutes telling Tod that they (our elected officials) needed to put away the penis rulers and work together on a compromise.

But, I guess I could be wrong.

 

So a Let Pauding Fly meeting is not about letting Paulding fly?

I would not be welcome at such a meeting, I know, because they have banned me from their web page for just trying to say the same stuff I said here.

Not a real open group.

The other group may not like what I say, but they don't ban me.

Here's a name, Let The People Speak.

Yeh, I got an issue with Mr. Rienhart or whatever his name is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was with you up until that funny thing you mentioned called "compromise". The last time I heard of any offer of compromise towards the Airport was that "tearful" speech by Todd Pownall that basically said " do it our way and our way only and we'll call it a compromise".

 

Now with that said... I agree with that other poster above, the one from 80%. At this point, who cares who started what, can we get on with it already?! Although, I'm not sure if h/she has ever attend Let Paulding Fly meetings where, BIG SURPRISE! airport is not the main dish on the menu and it's ALL about improving Paulding County starting with those every day concerns of safety, taxation, education, development, you know, the stuff that actually matters. Of course, no conversation I have every started with anti-airport people, no matter how far removed from the topic it was, could be exempted from it being mentioned, dwelled on, bitched about and refused to be steered away from the airport.

 

You know, the more I thought about your post, the more it bothered me.

I wrote an entire book about the airport on here and not one time did I denigrate a single person.

Yet your response wasn't even two sentences old before you were making snide comments about Tod Pownell.

Unless you have had a personal experienc, where you know that Mr. Pownell was crying crocodile tears, in my opinion, your reply was not called for.

Ohhh, just for the record, I have defended Blake Swafford and David Carmichael the same way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was with you up until that funny thing you mentioned called "compromise". The last time I heard of any offer of compromise towards the Airport was that "tearful" speech by Todd Pownall that basically said " do it our way and our way only and we'll call it a compromise".

 

Now with that said... I agree with that other poster above, the one from 80%. At this point, who cares who started what, can we get on with it already?! Although, I'm not sure if h/she has ever attend Let Paulding Fly meetings where, BIG SURPRISE! airport is not the main dish on the menu and it's ALL about improving Paulding County starting with those every day concerns of safety, taxation, education, development, you know, the stuff that actually matters. Of course, no conversation I have every started with anti-airport people, no matter how far removed from the topic it was, could be exempted from it being mentioned, dwelled on, bitched about and refused to be steered away from the airport.

Gee Jane Ty

Can you please advise me when and where the next Let Paulding Fly meeting will be held to talk about the items in bold above.

Got any minutes of those meetings that I could read?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The way the commercialization of the airport was brought about was shady. I expect the elected officials in my county to not act in a shady way. I'm not sure how everyone can't agree with this. When you can't be honest and upfront with the people you are representing I don't trust you to do the right thing. It's that simple.

  • Like 8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

You know, the more I thought about your post, the more it bothered me.

I wrote an entire book about the airport on here and not one time did I denigrate a single person.

Yet your response wasn't even two sentences old before you were making snide comments about Tod Pownell.

Unless you have had a personal experienc, where you know that Mr. Pownell was crying crocodile tears, in my opinion, your reply was not called for.

Ohhh, just for the record, I have defended Blake Swafford and David Carmichael the same way.

You are a much better person than me, then. I'm sorry if I offended you with my opinion about Todd Pownell and we're both entitled to our opinions. To say simply that I don't buy his "sincerity" act is an understatement. While I don't agree with the the other 2 commissioners, and I did get a chance to speak with Tony Crowe even if briefly, I find their actions to stem from their belief they are doing good for the community not out of grudge and hurt ego.

 

As for you not being welcome at the meeting because you were banned from their Facebook page, I would say why don't you give it a try. And to my knowledge, both sides have been known to delete comments and block people when the moderators feel the comments are too negative and it's up to their discretion.

 

Gee Jane Ty

Can you please advise me when and where the next Let Paulding Fly meeting will be held to talk about the items in bold above.

Got any minutes of those meetings that I could read?

Whitey, I am not the administrator of Let Paulding Fly and cannot provide you with anything legally. And to clarify, if you read my post I am talking about having conversations with other people. You know, when people are talking among themselves and people do attend such meetings not just for the meetings but to talk to other people to exchange opinions, thoughts, ideas etc etc, the main topic on everyone's lips is the development of the WHOLE county.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This was one of the shadiest deal that I have ever seen by any elected officials in Paulding County,

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are a much better person than me, then. I'm sorry if I offended you with my opinion about Todd Pownell and we're both entitled to our opinions. To say simply that I don't buy his "sincerity" act is an understatement. While I don't agree with the the other 2 commissioners, and I did get a chance to speak with Tony Crowe even if briefly, I find their actions to stem from their belief they are doing good for the community not out of grudge and hurt ego.

 

As for you not being welcome at the meeting because you were banned from their Facebook page, I would say why don't you give it a try. And to my knowledge, both sides have been known to delete comments and block people when the moderators feel the comments are too negative and it's up to their discretion.

 

Whitey, I am not the administrator of Let Paulding Fly and cannot provide you with anything legally. And to clarify, if you read my post I am talking about having conversations with other people. You know, when people are talking among themselves and people do attend such meetings not just for the meetings but to talk to other people to exchange opinions, thoughts, ideas etc etc, the main topic on everyone's lips is the development of the WHOLE county.

Heck I didn't even know that the let Paulding fly group had regular open meetings, where are they held at?

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Heck I didn't even know that the let Paulding fly group had regular open meetings, where are they held at?

I believe the meetings are held in that little PO Box in Dallas.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wrong Austin and his buddies started it by doing everything under the table. It was

voted down twice, but they did it anyway. The blame needs to fall on the people that did

this when it was not wanted. You may be one of the 80%, but I believe it is more

likely 80% against. Why did they (austin and friends) do this under the table?

Yes, the ones responsible should be ON THE HOOK, for all of the $$$$!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are a much better person than me, then. I'm sorry if I offended you with my opinion about Todd Pownell and we're both entitled to our opinions. To say simply that I don't buy his "sincerity" act is an understatement. While I don't agree with the the other 2 commissioners, and I did get a chance to speak with Tony Crowe even if briefly, I find their actions to stem from their belief they are doing good for the community not out of grudge and hurt ego.

 

As for you not being welcome at the meeting because you were banned from their Facebook page, I would say why don't you give it a try. And to my knowledge, both sides have been known to delete comments and block people when the moderators feel the comments are too negative and it's up to their discretion.

 

 

Whitey, I am not the administrator of Let Paulding Fly and cannot provide you with anything legally. And to clarify, if you read my post I am talking about having conversations with other people. You know, when people are talking among themselves and people do attend such meetings not just for the meetings but to talk to other people to exchange opinions, thoughts, ideas etc etc, the main topic on everyone's lips is the development of the WHOLE county.

Do you have a personal experience where Todd was insincere to you personally?

Ohhh wait, I already asked that question.

 

Note: this post has been edited to remove a stupid and unnecessary comment made by me

Edited by stradial

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes, the ones responsible should be ON THE HOOK, for all of the $$$$!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Again, that's your sides obsession with revenge that is just not practical, nor the way our country works. If that were the case, Obama would be on the hook for Obamacare, GWB would be paying for the Iraq war and Medicare Part B, and Clinton would be paying for Monica's therapy. It's not the real world, not sure how you guys got stuck in this revenge laden obsession that former politicians are on the hook personally for their failed agendas. If that were the case, then we would need to pay the ones that started successful programs.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Incredibly well thought out and well worded. Are you sure you don't want to be on the ballot? We need someone who is not "dug in" and can see through the windshield, not stare at the rear view mirror.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Again, that's your sides obsession with revenge that is just not practical, nor the way our country works. If that were the case, Obama would be on the hook for Obamacare, GWB would be paying for the Iraq war and Medicare Part B, and Clinton would be paying for Monica's therapy. It's not the real world, not sure how you guys got stuck in this revenge laden obsession that former politicians are on the hook personally for their failed agendas. If that were the case, then we would need to pay the ones that started successful programs.

Can we get this program approved?

We would only have to pay one out of ever few hundred politicians.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can we get this program approved?

We would only have to pay one out of ever few hundred politicians.

 

I didn't say that I didn't think this was a great idea, just that it's not practical :).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was with you up until that funny thing you mentioned called "compromise". The last time I heard of any offer of compromise towards the Airport was that "tearful" speech by Todd Pownall that basically said " do it our way and our way only and we'll call it a compromise".

 

Now with that said... I agree with that other poster above, the one from 80%. At this point, who cares who started what, can we get on with it already?! Although, I'm not sure if h/she has ever attend Let Paulding Fly meetings where, BIG SURPRISE! airport is not the main dish on the menu and it's ALL about improving Paulding County starting with those every day concerns of safety, taxation, education, development, you know, the stuff that actually matters. Of course, no conversation I have every started with anti-airport people, no matter how far removed from the topic it was, could be exempted from it being mentioned, dwelled on, bitched about and refused to be steered away from the airport.

 

 

Isn't the airport issue ultimately about taxation ? ? ?

 

We are now on the hook for $3.6 million in bonds...

 

All the risk and no reward is not a good deal for taxpayers.

 

 

8)

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sounds like the movie studio all over again. Wasted money by the old regime.

Now follow the money and see who did profit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The way the commercialization of the airport was brought about was shady. I expect the elected officials in my county to not act in a shady way. I'm not sure how everyone can't agree with this. When you can't be honest and upfront with the people you are representing I don't trust you to do the right thing. It's that simple.

You have well defined the Real Issue. The airport issue is a result of the Real Issue. We know secret meetings started in (maybe before) June 2012. Amazingly the results of these secret meetings became public on October 3, 2013. I'm convinced the 15 or 16 months of silence was a result of the "Loose Lips Sink Ships" business plan. One thing that needs to happen NOW is for the Open Meetings lawsuit to be allowed to proceed by our Airport Authority.

 

We will never start healing till the Real Issue is exposed and dealt with.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You have well defined the Real Issue. The airport issue is a result of the Real Issue. We know secret meetings started in (maybe before) June 2012. Amazingly the results of these secret meetings became public on October 3, 2013. I'm convinced the 15 or 16 months of silence was a result of the "Loose Lips Sink Ships" business plan. One thing that needs to happen NOW is for the Open Meetings lawsuit to be allowed to proceed by our Airport Authority.

 

We will never start healing till the Real Issue is exposed and dealt with.

 

Mojo, I enjoy reading your intelligent posts and find myself in agreement with you frequently. Here, we part ways respectfully.

We keep going back to "well this happened years ago". In politics, your revenge is to fire the politician, which you guys did. That didn't satisfy you guys, the pound of flesh wasn't enough.

The revenge on a cheating husband is to divorce him. There are, however, many women where the divorce didn't satisfy them, so they follow their ex around making sure that the next woman knows, so she can keep getting her revenge. It's not the way our system was set up, and it's not healthy to stalk your ex.

 

You guys fired them and / or they are in their final terms now, more folks attend BOC meetings than ever before. These are all good, American things to do. To keep punishing the taxpayers of the county so you guys can get revenge on fired politicians makes my 80% of the county resent you all.

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mojo, I enjoy reading your intelligent posts and find myself in agreement with you frequently. Here, we part ways respectfully.

We keep going back to "well this happened years ago". In politics, your revenge is to fire the politician, which you guys did. That didn't satisfy you guys, the pound of flesh wasn't enough.

 

The revenge on a cheating husband is to divorce him. There are, however, many women where the divorce didn't satisfy them, so they follow their ex around making sure that the next woman knows, so she can keep getting her revenge. It's not the way our system was set up, and it's not healthy to stalk your ex.

 

You guys fired them and / or they are in their final terms now, more folks attend BOC meetings than ever before. These are all good, American things to do. To keep punishing the taxpayers of the county so you guys can get revenge on fired politicians makes my 80% of the county resent you all.

 

The lawsuit is filed.

It is not being dropped, so it needs to be resolved in the courts.

If the court case shows laws or rules were broken, then that would also be the American way.

If the court case shows that laws or rules were not violated then, again, that is the American way.

Edited by stradial
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Mojo, I enjoy reading your intelligent posts and find myself in agreement with you frequently. Here, we part ways respectfully.

We keep going back to "well this happened years ago". In politics, your revenge is to fire the politician, which you guys did. That didn't satisfy you guys, the pound of flesh wasn't enough.

The revenge on a cheating husband is to divorce him. There are, however, many women where the divorce didn't satisfy them, so they follow their ex around making sure that the next woman knows, so she can keep getting her revenge. It's not the way our system was set up, and it's not healthy to stalk your ex.

 

You guys fired them and / or they are in their final terms now, more folks attend BOC meetings than ever before. These are all good, American things to do. To keep punishing the taxpayers of the county so you guys can get revenge on fired politicians makes my 80% of the county resent you all.

 

two things. first the 80% is a fantasy of yours that is not based on any discernable facts .

 

Secondly some of the politicians that were a party to this fiasco are still in office and some resigned from office only to announce that they will be running for higher office. and their appointees are still in place.

 

With the exception of Doris Devey and MATT there has been no changes in the make up of the PCAA whatsoever..

 

Blake and Calvin are still the leaders of the PCAA and both must be dealt with before they do anymore damage.

 

It is obvious to most folks that Blake and Calvin has not been very adept at guiding the PCAA through the growth of the General Aviation airport and they along with others need to be replaced with capable persons. How in the world did we ever allow a former DOT worker and a earth mover ever attempt to run our $70,000,000 asset ?

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

two things. first the 80% is a fantasy of yours that is not based on any discernable facts .

 

 

 

This is not a fantasy. The ridiculous turnout to the last local election proves this. Plus, get out of your circle, and ask Joe Paulding Citizen. You throw out a statement like this saying it's not based on facts. A whopping 14.4% of the county turned out for this election. That means that 85% of the county did not give a rat's @ss about your revenge vendetta on this airport. http://www.ajc.com/news/business/anti-airport-commercialization-candidates-win-race/nf458/. Actually, my number now seems a little low.

 

 

Most either don't know or don't care about this. I'm not saying this is right, it just is.

 

Folks in Bentwater, Seven Hills, Senator's Ridge and other North and East Paulding neighborhoods only come into Dallas to get their tags or go to the courthouse. They don't eat here, don't shop here and don't care about politics here. They care about the schools, that's it. Most have Acworth addresses.

 

I understand and respect that the folks in Yorkville and Beulah are passionate about this. But...they are terribly outnumbered by folks who pay a ton into this county, but could care less if planes start taking off from the other side of the county. Most of us on this side of the county have C130's flying overhead all the time now, sometimes so low that we can literally wave at the crew (which most of us think is pretty cool). We don't empathize with the woods on the far side of the county. Again, I'm not saying this is right, it's just reality.

 

 

Edited by Newbie in New Hope

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

This is not a fantasy. The ridiculous turnout to the last local election proves this. Plus, get out of your circle, and ask Joe Paulding Citizen. You throw out a statement like this saying it's not based on facts. A whopping 14.4% of the county turned out for this election. That means that 85% of the county did not give a rat's @ss about your revenge vendetta on this airport. http://www.ajc.com/news/business/anti-airport-commercialization-candidates-win-race/nf458/. Actually, my number now seems a little low.

 

 

Most either don't know or don't care about this. I'm not saying this is right, it just is.

 

Folks in Bentwater, Seven Hills, Senator's Ridge and other North and East Paulding neighborhoods only come into Dallas to get their tags or go to the courthouse. They don't eat here, don't shop here and don't care about politics here. They care about the schools, that's it. Most have Acworth addresses.

 

I understand and respect that the folks in Yorkville and Beulah are passionate about this. But...they are terribly outnumbered by folks who pay a ton into this county, but could care less if planes start taking off from the other side of the county. Most of us on this side of the county have C130's flying overhead all the time now, sometimes so low that we can literally wave at the crew (which most of us think is pretty cool). We don't empathize with the woods on the far side of the county. Again, I'm not saying this is right, it's just reality.

 

 

Newbie, I can tell you this: If that Part 139 application happened to be approved, you can bet your bottom dollar that the whole county will know about our airport. And they will care, but it will be too late then. The citizens will have no input as to how the airport is to be run.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Newbie, I can tell you this: If that Part 139 application happened to be approved, you can bet your bottom dollar that the whole county will know about our airport. And they will care, but it will be too late then. The citizens will have no input as to how the airport is to be run.

 

I don't know roadcrosses. I'm not defending apathy and disinterest, just pointing out that it exists in much larger numbers than either side concedes. In my line of work, I deal with the general public of this county. Most are not on this board, not attending meetings, don't read the local paper, and are not engaged. By most, I literally mean 80%. The last local election supports my theory with hard numbers. That seems so unreal to both sides, as we all as humans tend to surround ourselves with folks that are like us, therefore assuming "there are more of us than them".

 

Plus, both sides need to realize that, even the informed folks, may not care as much about the airport as they do. I've read both sides and all the information, and consider myself fairly informed on this issue. I still just don't find it to be a big deal either way. The day after the FAA makes it's decision, the sun will still rise. We'll be just fine either way.

 

Both sides remind me of John McCain being so convinced that everyone was as passionate as he and his vocal supporters were about campaign finance reform. At the end of the day, what he woke up every morning thinking about was of very little interest to most of this country.

 

I don't like this either. I would love 100% voter turnout, everyone be engaged, then we could put this baby to bed. Our founders would be ashamed of what we have done through apathy to their Republic.

Edited by Newbie in New Hope
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

... Most either don't know or don't care about this. I'm not saying this is right, it just is.

 

Folks in Bentwater, Seven Hills, Senator's Ridge and other North and East Paulding neighborhoods only come into Dallas to get their tags or go to the courthouse. They don't eat here, don't shop here and don't care about politics here. They care about the schools, that's it. Most have Acworth addresses. ...

 

 

I thought exactly the same thing... Until Thursday night at an informational meeting in North Paulding where residents in 4 of the county's larger HOA's where invited to hear about North Paulding roads, schools and the reservior. Tony Crowe was sitting in the bleachers and when the meeting closed he stepped onto the gym floor where he was immediately surrounded by residents questoning the airport status. I just stood back & listened. It's amazing how much I hear when I listen.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought exactly the same thing... Until Thursday night at an informational meeting in North Paulding where residents in 4 of the county's larger HOA's where invited to hear about North Paulding roads, schools and the reservior. Tony Crowe was sitting in the bleachers and when the meeting closed he stepped onto the gym floor where he was immediately surrounded by residents questoning the airport status. I just stood back & listened. It's amazing how much I hear when I listen.

 

Well that's a good thing, but keep in mind that if 200 people were there, that's less than 1% of the folks that live in those neighborhoods. Everyone was so excited that 300 people showed up at the town hall at the airport on Dec 1st. I thought that was quite pathetic, especially when both sides started saying a large chunk of the cars had out of state / county tags. 300 / 140,000 = .002%. Again, not a large percentage of this county cares about this, we just want it to be over.

Edited by Newbie in New Hope

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Calvin made a promise to the people of this county that the airport would never ever go commercial.

 

Calvin lied and is now pushing for commercial passenger service.The only way to make a liar keep his word is to take him to court.

 

 

Don't be like Calvin

  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Calvin made a promise to the people of this county that the airport would never ever go commercial.

 

Calvin lied and is now pushing for commercial passenger service.The only way to make a liar keep his word is to take him to court.

 

 

Don't be like Calvin

 

And the income tax was only meant to pay for the war, I'm sure 278 was meant to be a 2 lane, North Paulding was supposed to be rolling woodlands. Things change.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...