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surepip

How do viral diseases such as Ebola and influenza spread?

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Generally the virus in the host sheds contagions that may have to be ingested (GI Tract with feces), or body fluids, ingested, or absorbed through a cut or open wound or sexually), or, the worst, via airborne droplets breathed in (respitory).

 

For diseases like AI, its generally from a live bird in direct contact with the new host.

 

It can be spread by fecal contact when cleaning and eviscerating the infected animal, and you are exposed to the virus in the intestines.

 

Respiratory is the most virulent. This becomes a problem in 3rd world countries where the family has the chickens in the house with them.

 

If your neighbor has yard birds, you do not want to be walking in their feces, or letting them into your house.

 

It generally is NOT by casual contact.

 

I visit the poultry houses and on occasion have to enter the house. I like to have a disposable jumpsuit, plastic booties, and I "shower in" and "shower out" as an additional precaution. The jumpsuit is left in the trash, normally to be incinerated.

 

You will not catch AI or other viruses from casual exposure to the flesh. And when properly cooked there is nothing left to spread any disease.

 

Hand washing is probably at the top of the list.

 

As far as the neighors birds? Just don't kiss the chickens and you'll be OK.!!!

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Suerpip; Is it still safe to eat chicken and eggs? I don't mind going full-blown vegetarian now.

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You cannot buy a chicken or eggs on the USA from a retailer registered with the USDA that is not 100% safe from avian influrnza or salmonella enteritidus. I'm having chicken fingers and veggies baked with an egg wash breadcrumb coating for dinner.

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SP - would you ever have a chicken coop and raise your own chickens/eggs? Just curious...I don't want one (I's still skeert from gathering eggs as a kid!), but I do know a lot of folks have them. Also, you have discussed the pros/cons of same before, but I would like to hear it again (I've slept since then). ;)

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Generally the virus in the host sheds contagions that may have to be ingested (GI Tract with feces), or body fluids, ingested, or absorbed through a cut or open wound or sexually), or, the worst, via airborne droplets breathed in (respitory).

 

For diseases like AI, its generally from a live bird in direct contact with the new host.

 

It can be spread by fecal contact when cleaning and eviscerating the infected animal, and you are exposed to the virus in the intestines.

 

Respitory is the most virulent. This becomes a problem in 3rd world countries where the family has the chickens in the house with them.

 

If your neighbor has yard birds, you do not want to be walking in their feces, or letting them into your house.

 

It generally is NOT by casual contact.

 

I visit the poultry houses and on occasion have to enter the house. I like to have a disposable kpsuit, plastic booties, and I "shower in" and "shower out" as an additional precaution. The jumpsuit is left in the trash, noslly to be incinerated.

 

You will not catch AI or other viruses fr casual exposure to the flesh. And when properly cooled there is nothing left to spread anything.

 

Hand washing is probably at the top of the list.

 

Do just don't kiss the chickens and you'll be OK.!!!

 

So does this mean the first two missionaries that were flown into Emory were likely screwing chickens, each other or natives? Seems that is about the only way they could have contracted the virus.

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SP - would you ever have a chicken coop and raise your own chickens/eggs? Just curious...I don't want one (I's still skeert from gathering eggs as a kid!), but I do know a lot of folks have them. Also, you have discussed the pros/cons of same before, but I would like to hear it again (I've slept since then). ;)

In reply to your question of would I have a backyard flock of layers, Yes, I would love to. And with egg prices the past couple of years, it would be economically profitable. Not to mention fresh eggs outside my back door would be a huge plus. A few geese as well.

 

But I would have to retire. In addition to the bio security we have at hatcheries, where we might have 4-5 million eggs and chicks, I also visit primary breeder facilities. Farms with the parent bird, grandparent, and great grandparents. The GGP birds are worth hundreds to thousands of dollars each. The primary breeders are literally priceless, and never are sold. They are proprietary to that breeder company.

 

When I visit one of these facilities, I have to sign in, stating I have no birds of any kind of my own, and that I have not been around or exposed to any other birds for 96 hours.

 

Most of the diseases the chooks can catch, are easily transmitted by people.

 

A common question on a job application for the poultry companies for workers dealing with the live production of the birds asks if your neighbors have backyard flocks, and are they penned up or free ranging?

 

We try to breed for specific resistance to specific diseases, kind of like a tomato plant resistant to the tobacco mosaic virus, etc. But, as a rule of thumb, to get certain DNA inherent resistance or immunity, we tend to give up more economically favorable traits such as feed conversion, uniformity, leg strength, and other critical attributes.

 

Again, this is a driving factor in trying to control viral and bacterial diseases by eradicating them at the source and practicing proper bio security protocols instead of vaccinating or treating sick birds.

 

It's cheaper in the long run to destroy flocks which catch a disease, and much safer.

 

So No, as much as I'd. Like to have my own layers, I can't until I'm done working with the birds hands on in person.

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So does this mean the first two missionaries that were flown into Emory were likely screwing chickens, each other or natives? Seems that is about the only way they could have contracted the virus.

He's referring to avian flu, not ebola.

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He's referring to avian flu, not ebola.

Ebola is in the title of his post, so it appears he's telling us that not kissing chickens is the key to not getting ebola.

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It is a discussion of the way that viruses are transmitted. The idea is that chickens are used an an example.

 

The effort to ridicule is childish.

 

pubby

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Generally the virus in the host sheds contagions that may have to be ingested (GI Tract with feces), or body fluids, ingested, or absorbed through a cut or open wound or sexually), or, the worst, via airborne droplets breathed in (respitory).

 

For diseases like AI, its generally from a live bird in direct contact with the new host.

 

It can be spread by fecal contact when cleaning and eviscerating the infected animal, and you are exposed to the virus in the intestines.

 

Respiratory is the most virulent. This becomes a problem in 3rd world countries where the family has the chickens in the house with them.

 

If your neighbor has yard birds, you do not want to be walking in their feces, or letting them into your house.

 

It generally is NOT by casual contact.

 

I visit the poultry houses and on occasion have to enter the house. I like to have a disposable kpsuit, plastic booties, and I "shower in" and "shower out" as an additional precaution. The jumpsuit is left in the trash, normally to be incinerated.

 

You will not catch AI or other viruses from casual exposure to the flesh. And when properly cooled there is nothing left to spread anything.

 

Hand washing is probably at the top of the list.

 

Do just don't kiss the chickens and you'll be OK.!!!

Thank you so much for answering my PM regarding my neighbors and their chickens.

 

No problem with kissing the chickens, although I have named a few of them. I know I'm just setting myself up for heartbreak, but they're kinda cute!

 

Do you see my hesitancy in using the open board now? LOL! I'm just not thick skinned enough for some of the comments.

 

Thanks again, you're the best!

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Thank you so much for answering my PM regarding my neighbors and their chickens.

 

No problem with kissing the chickens, although I have named a few of them. I know I'm just setting myself up for heartbreak, but they're kinda cute!

 

Do you see my hesitancy in using the open board now? LOL! I'm just not thick skinned enough for some of the comments.

 

Thanks again, you're the best!

 

 

If a long time member like yourself, Dana, is so hesitant to use the open board, than is it any wonder people who might agree with me, or Dr. Phil for that matter, is hesitant to do just that.

 

And, what about newcomers? Would they be hesitant to use the open board?

 

You don't have to answer that, on here, but you do know the answer. :give_rose:

Edited by The Postman

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It is a discussion of the way that viruses are transmitted. The idea is that chickens are used an an example.

 

The effort to ridicule is childish.

 

pubby

It's not an effort to ridicule.

 

The title specifically names Influenza and Ebola. They are not listed by name in the body, so when the final line says " Do just don't kiss the chickens and you'll be OK.!!!" what is the reader supposed to think?

 

Change the title to read Aivain Influenza instead of Ebola and it will make a lot more sense!

Edited by markdavd

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It's not an effort to ridicule.

 

The title specifically names Influenza and Ebola. They are not listed by name in the body, so when the final line says " Do just don't kiss the chickens and you'll be OK.!!!" what is the reader supposed to think?

 

Change the title to read Aivain Influenza instead of Ebola and it will make a lot more sense!

 

 

Making sense to a conservative is not going to happen, very often, markdavd!

 

Ebola is spread like any other disease that is not airborne. It's spread by contact.

Edited by The Postman

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It's not an effort to ridicule.

 

The title specifically names Influenza and Ebola. They are not listed by name in the body, so when the final line says " Do just don't kiss the chickens and you'll be OK.!!!" what is the reader supposed to think?

 

Change the title to read Aivain Influenza instead of Ebola and it will make a lot more sense!

 

But you may be right. No research has been done between chickens and ebola that I am aware of.

 

Chickens, people and pigs all have similar flu receptacles in their sinuses. Taking that one, I assume ebola possibly does as well, but has not found a mechanism to lie in the lungs, ........yet.

 

So no, kissing the chicken would not necessarily expose you to ebola, but would expose you to Avian Influenza if they had it.

 

Come on now Feelip, I expect this from MarkDavid, but not from you.

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what I don't understand is that Ebola has been around awhile, before HIV or right around the time HIV was coming on the scene.Wonder why it has all of a sudden came back in such high proportions? I don't keep up on all this and it is quite scary stuff.

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But you may be right. No research has been done between chickens and ebola that I am aware of.

 

Chickens, people and pigs all have similar flu receptacles in their sinuses. Taking that one, I assume ebola possibly does as well, but has not found a mechanism to lie in the lungs, ........yet.

 

So no, kissing the chicken would not necessarily expose you to ebola, but would expose you to Avian Influenza if they had it.

 

Come on now Feelip, I expect this from MarkDavid, but not from you.

 

What I know is that by choking your chicken you decrease your risk of contracting any viruses.

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what I don't understand is that Ebola has been around awhile, before HIV or right around the time HIV was coming on the scene.Wonder why it has all of a sudden came back in such high proportions? I don't keep up on all this and it is quite scary stuff.

On going evolutionary mutations. Viruses mutate rapidly and are extroudinary at adapting to new challenges to their environment.

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I think the big difference between this outbreak and previous ones is that the earlier outbreaks were in remote villages where, if it killed everyone, 50 people would die and no one else would come along for another six months and they'd all be gone.

 

Of course the recent outbreaks - at least since the 70s - have usually been discovered but because they were taking place in remote locations, they didn't spread and were easily controlled.

 

pubby

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Hey, Surepip, I FINALLY got a girl for Duke. He is a happy camper. Still need to get at least 3 more girls though.

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I think the big difference between this outbreak and previous ones is that the earlier outbreaks were in remote villages where, if it killed everyone, 50 people would die and no one else would come along for another six months and they'd all be gone.

 

Of course the recent outbreaks - at least since the 70s - have usually been discovered but because they were taking place in remote locations, they didn't spread and were easily controlled.

 

pubby

 

Good point.

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But you may be right. No research has been done between chickens and ebola that I am aware of.

 

Chickens, people and pigs all have similar flu receptacles in their sinuses. Taking that one, I assume ebola possibly does as well, but has not found a mechanism to lie in the lungs, ........yet.

 

So no, kissing the chicken would not necessarily expose you to ebola, but would expose you to Avian Influenza if they had it.

 

Come on now Feelip, I expect this from MarkDavid, but not from you.

Because your title still says 'Ebola and Influenza', but your post seems to only describe AI, are you telling jus that Ebola, Influenza and AI all spread the same?

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Ebola is in the title of his post, so it appears he's telling us that not kissing chickens is the key to not getting ebola.

If, and its not a very big if, we had a permutation of a hi path avian influenza and Ebola, just breathing the same air with an infected chicken could pass the virus.

 

As I understand Ebola currently, it is transferred from body fluids. I have seen no data on GI Tract livability. Stomach fluids generally destroy pathogens. But not AI from infected chickens to other chickens. I don't know if this has been studied in people ingesting it. It would definitely transmit via the soft mouth tissues.

 

My point, for those too dense to understand is Ebola currently would classify as difficult to casually transmit people to people. As is AI currently. Chicken to chicken is almost autatic, just a question of how fast.

 

If Ebola or AI mutated just ever so slightly, and shared an ability to live in the human respitory system, given AIs contagiousness and ebolas deadliness, then we would have a super bug capable of taking out half the worlds population.

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Here's an interesting article from a small study they did during the last Ebola outbreak:

 

Ebola lab samples yield questions as well as answers

 

Interesting that the virus can live in and be transmitted via some body fluids weeks after the paitent is 'cured.'

 

One thing i would like to see addressed is the because it can live a short time in saliva, does that mean it can be transmitted via sneezing or cauighing? That may not be considered 'aerosol' but is airborn non the less.

 

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If, and its not a very big if, we had a permutation of a hi path avian influenza and Ebola, just breathing the same air with an infected chicken could pass the virus.

 

As I understand Ebola currently, it is transferred from body fluids. I have seen no data on GI Tract livability. Stomach fluids generally destroy pathogens. But not AI from infected chickens to other chickens. I don't know if this has been studied in people ingesting it. It would definitely transmit via the soft mouth tissues.

 

My point, for those too dense to understand is Ebola currently would classify as difficult to casually transmit people to people. As is AI currently. Chicken to chicken is almost autatic, just a question of how fast.

 

If Ebola or AI mutated just ever so slightly, and shared an ability to live in the human respitory system, given AIs contagiousness and ebolas deadliness, then we would have a super bug capable of taking out half the worlds population.

It seems to be know that Ebola can be transmitted by eating monkey or bat meat. While that's not likely to happen in the US, the question would be can it be transmitted from other animals. The government killed a dog in Spain because the owner had Ebola. Did they know somthing or was it just a knee-jerk reaction?

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Is ebola getting its start from eating the flesh?

 

Or from gutting and cleaning/processing the meat, getting blood all over their hands, with no gloves and several unhealed cuts and scratches?

 

Possibly consuming the flesh not thoroughly cooked? Where oral tissue could absorb it ??

 

Most native customs and oral traditions would have them cook the snot out of any flesh that might be contaminated, so my guess is the blood.

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Is ebola getting its start from eating the flesh?

 

Or from gutting and cleaning/processing the meat, getting blood all over their hands, with no gloves and several unhealed cuts and scratches?

 

Possibly consuming the flesh not thoroughly cooked? Where oral tissue could absorb it ??

 

Most native customs and oral traditions would have them cook the snot out of any flesh that might be contaminated, so my guess is the blood.

You're right about those preparing the meat being at greater risk, along with those who consume undercooked meat. The problem is they aren't believing what the health professionals are telling them.

 

For those interested, here's an article on the subject:

Why West Africans keep hunting and eating bush meat despite Ebola concerns

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Here's an interesting article from a small study they did during the last Ebola outbreak:

 

Ebola lab samples yield questions as well as answers

 

Interesting that the virus can live in and be transmitted via some body fluids weeks after the paitent is 'cured.'

 

One thing i would like to see addressed is the because it can live a short time in saliva, does that mean it can be transmitted via sneezing or cauighing? That may not be considered 'aerosol' but is airborn non the less.

 

 

 

The director of the CDC cannot answer that basic question :

 

 

http://minx.cc:1080/?post=352191

 

 

8)

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