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Need input from those familiar with IEP, Schools and parental rights


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Here is the situation. History... He has been bounced from school to school since he started. He is considered "special needs" and is under an IEP currently. Since he started he went to Ritch, then Hutchins, then Panter, then Nebo and now New Hope Education Center. He even had 3 seperate teachers while at Panter for only 2 years. We have never moved. He was doing extremely well at Panter with very few episodes that would require me to go to the school. Even if I did, it was because they did not want him to ride the bus home. This year he was reassigned to Nebo. We took it in stride and started working with the new staff again. We started having "issues" right away. And not with him but rather administrative issues. I tried to work with the staff. After a month or so I felt we got them resolved. Until I got a call from DFACS. Please remember that along with the ADHD / ODD type issues we also have to deal with tactile and sensory issues from time to time. This is VERY common with these children. He is supposed to be in a class with specially TRAINED and knowlegable teachers. They saw him wearing the same type clothing every day and did not feel the need to discuss this with me at all before calling DFACS. If they had they would have discovered that he had no less than 7 pairs of the exact same shorts and numerous white undershirts (that being his uniform of choice) all in order to minimize any morning confrontations about what to wear to school and starting his day off on the wrong foot. But as typical with the staff there, they seem to me, to be totally incompetent when it come to dealing with this kind of stuff. We saw an increasing trend towards difficulty with his teachers and staff despite our best efforts. They would call me daily requiring me to pick him up for some reason or another. The situation culminated with his breakdown and being sent to Peachford for evaluation and intervention. When he went back to school after the Christmas break he was assigned to New Hope. He has again done consistantly better there and once again enjoys going to school. I have not had to go pick him up at all. When talking about his performance and their assessment of him I always hear the same thing "we do not see ANY of the issues reported by the staff at Nebo". To me that clearly indicates an issue at Nebo. All that is fine with me as it is now. That is in the past and he is happy and doing well.

 

 

 

Now the problem. I got a call from the new director for these services today. She indicated that next year he would once again be moved. WHAT?!?! You realize that he has already been moved 4 times, he is in 4th grade and we have never moved right? "Really??" To where? "Well a centralized location". And New hope isn't? " Well the only facility that would suit his needs will be Nebo". NEBO?!?!? You have to be kidding me! They are incompetent. "Why would you say that". I tell the lady that he is in the most restrictive environment now and there is no where else to send him beyond that. You guys are setting him up to fail! So I start explaining. All she can say is "we have to approach this with a more positive attitude." I tell her to go pull Dis jr. out of class and tell him this and see how he responds. :wacko: Now I am so angry that I could spit 16 penny nails!!

 

 

Any input with my rights, directions of response or contacts for advocates would be greatly appeciated.

 

TIA

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Well, I know a ton about special education and I will tell you this....the courts have ruled time and time again that the IEP guarantees placement, not location. That's what they're betting on here. However, if you can prove that a particular location is detrimental to your child, then it's a game changer. I can recommend an advocate who causes me to cringe every time I hear her name....because she's good....but you'll pay. IF it were me, I'd start by requesting a copy of my parental rights. This will get someone's attention. Then I would read them. If you find a violation, file a grievance with the state dept of education. This is outlined in the parental rights packet. Read the section on "notice" and "participation" .... There might be a violation in there somewhere. I'd get on this pronto. I don't know what the summer schedule is like and you don't want to delay this too long, I'll also add that the school to which you are unhappy with has quite the reputation in the county. There might be a support group meeting at a local bar.

Edited by workingforaliving
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Well, I know a ton about special education and I will tell you this....the courts have ruled time and time again that the IEP guarantees placement, not location. That's what they're betting on here. However, if you can prove that a particular location is detrimental to your child, then it's a game changer. I can recommend an advocate who causes me to cringe every time I hear her name....because she's good....but you'll pay. IF it were me, I'd start by requesting a copy of my parental rights. This will get someone's attention. Then I would read them. If you find a violation, file a grievance with the state dept of education. This is outlined in the parental rights packet. Read the section on "notice" and "participation" .... There might be a violation in there somewhere. I'd get on this pronto. I don't know what the summer schedule is like and you don't want to delay this too long, I'll also add that the school to which you are unhappy with has quite the reputation in the county. There might be a support group meeting at a local bar.

 

We actually have his IEP scheduled already for next year. It is next Wednesday.

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1366245571[/url]' post='3791645']

We actually have his IEP scheduled already for next year. It is next Wednesday.

Is it an annual IEP or an addendum?

 

The law requires that parental concerns be addressed at IEP meetings. Make sure you're concerns are DOCUMENTED in the IEP, because it'll help you down the road when you pursue this or if you need to come back and say that your concerns were ignored.create a trail. Try to work together keeping your son as the center of the discussion.

After that IEP meeting, I can help you more.

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Is it an annual IEP or an addendum?

 

The law requires that parental concerns be addressed at IEP meetings. Make sure you're concerns are DOCUMENTED in the IEP, because it'll help you down the road when you pursue this or if you need to come back and say that your concerns were ignored.create a trail. Try to work together keeping your son as the center of the discussion.

After that IEP meeting, I can help you more.

 

This should be his yearly.

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I have no advice to give, I just hope you get it figured out and he gets to stay at the school that helps him thrive. I know if I were you I would be very upset. My son has a lot of sensory issues, I worry a lot about him starting school.

 

ETA- I do know that when the time comes for my child to go to school, I will listen to any advice that WFAL has to give.

Edited by jenilyn
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Nebo is having issues with support from admin. It is sad but you will have to make them follow the IEP to the letter. It is my experience that it is not the IEP teachers. It is the teachers in the inclusion classes that wont follow IEP and admin won't make them do it either. I'm also faced with hiring an advocate but admin knows I mean business and I will call them on every thing they do wrong and will make them explain everything they do.

I have come to the conclusion that I am my child's administrative assistant. It is totally pathetic that I have to check the work that the teachers give my child to make sure that they are following the friggin rules.

 

OVERIT can give you some pointers too. She fought the system and the system didn't win, she did. ;)

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I'm very surprised they never tried him at Poole. My son was having issues at Abney and they told me that Poole would be the only place that would be able to help him. I live within walking distance of the New Hope Education Center and thought they were only using it for staff training.

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I have come to the conclusion that I am my child's administrative assistant. It is totally pathetic that I have to check the work that the teachers give my child to make sure that they are following the friggin rules.

 

OVERIT can give you some pointers too. She fought the system and the system didn't win, she did. ;)

 

Oh, hell, no - they would rue the day they ever heard my name if they tried to pull this crap. Excellent of you to ask for advice, and sounds like some folks here have some good experience and advice. I can't imagine you folks who have to deal with these dilberts all the time. I'd be in jail, I swear I would. :angry2:

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Check out "parents educating parents" They have a office in Douglasville and they are a non-profit advocate group. I got a lot done for my son 20 years ago at EPMS by just threatening the school with them. Good luck they will help you.

Edited by ProudMawMawof5
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In the end, IEP's are a negotiation.

 

Parents have gotten increasingly less power in the negotiation since 1995 but still, they can cause the schools a great deal of expense and time. Ultimately you can force a a formal hearing in front of an administrative judge who will rule on the case and, at least when I was doing this, pursuing your 'due process' rights you can keep your son where he is until the issue is resolved.

 

If the rulings haven't changed and he is not at Nebo and you don't want him at Nebo, and they continue to have a program where he is, they can't summarily move him as long as you are protesting the move.

 

If you have proof ... say of suspensions; detailed reports, a review, report from an independent medical professional (psychologist, neurologist, etc.) that says that they saw regression in behaviors at Nebo; that will be important in winning final placement elsewhere.

 

While it is always better to have an attorney present during a due process hearing, you can do it pro se. (represent yourself). In either case as part of the process you would be able to subpoena the teachers, aides, bus drivers, LEO that may have been called in to remove your child, etc. I.e. you can present your case and ask the folks at Nebo what the problem was and their opinions, etc. under oath.

 

I did it back in 1996 ... I lost but we got more of what we wanted than had we folded if for no other reason, our threat to go to due process had enhanced credibility.

 

pubby

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WOW a lot has changed since DS was at Nebo. We absolutely loved it there. But, we didn't have the kind of issues with DS that you have with Jr. The only teacher that I did have an issue with was DS 4th grade teacher, and even then it was over politics, not son's IEP.

 

I do hope you can get the answers you need.

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at most schools, the inclusion teacher is the one whose turn it is to be it; those teachers are general ed, who have been given the sped kids with parapros...in other words, few teachers choose the situation and are not trained to be there...I personally think most kids with IEPs are better served in a small group, with a teacher trained for their abilities, who WANT to teach them...inclusion is usally not the route teachers would choose for these kids, who need more attention and more skilled teachers

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inclusion is where we have the most problems. My childs small group teachers are frustrated beyond frustrated with the system and admin. I like the small group the best but it is necessary to try to get them to function in a larger setting both academically and socially. Admin would like all classes in the regular classroom setting. It seems I always have to pitch a fit to keep her in small group.

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My granddaughter is in the IEP program at Abney and she's been there for 2 years. Before that, she was at Poole, Northside, Ragsdale, Dallas, and Allgood.......I think that's all. She's in 4th grade and according to everything we've been told, you have to move with the program. WE HATE IT!!!! However, the new teacher that Park has at Abney is WONDERFUL, and she has progressed beyond our wildest dreams and as far as we know, her program is staying where it is.

 

The goal for her this year was to speak consistently in complete sentences and she has achieved that goal thanks to her talented and dedicated teacher.

 

IMO, these students need the most structure and sameness in their everyday schedules. It's ridiculous that they're the ones moved on a whim.

Edited by momof 3
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My granddaughter is in the IEP program at Abney and she's been there for 2 years. Before that, she was at Poole, Northside, Ragsdale, Dallas, and Allgood.......I think that's all. She's in 4th grade and according to everything we've been told, you have to move with the program. WE HATE IT!!!! However, the new teacher that Park has at Abney is WONDERFUL, and she has progressed beyond our wildest dreams and as far as we know, her program is staying where it is.

 

The goal for her this year was to speak consistently in complete sentences and she has achieved that goal thanks to her talented and dedicated teacher.

 

IMO, these students need the most structure and sameness in their everyday schedules. It's ridiculous that they re the ones moved on a whim.

Exactly! (To your last paragraph). I don't understand it at all.

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at most schools, the inclusion teacher is the one whose turn it is to be it; those teachers are general ed, who have been given the sped kids with parapros...in other words, few teachers choose the situation and are not trained to be there...I personally think most kids with IEPs are better served in a small group, with a teacher trained for their abilities, who WANT to teach them...inclusion is usally not the route teachers would choose for these kids, who need more attention and more skilled teachers

 

 

Dis jr. was in dedicated small group at the regional school (Nebo). He had a teacher that was at Inner Harbor for years and the assistant who had years at Deveroux. That is what is crazy. Both SHOULD have been able to cover his needs and UNDERSTAND his sensory issues WITHOUT going to DFACS and not discussing them with me. Now he is at NHEC which currently is a dedicated school program from the hard to handle students. So he is in the most restrictive environment as far as the school goes but has the most flexability in his daily program with the better trained teachers.

 

My granddaughter is in the IEP program at Abney and she's been there for 2 years. Before that, she was at Poole, Northside, Ragsdale, Dallas, and Allgood.......I think that's all. She's in 4th grade and according to everything we've been told, you have to move with the program. WE HATE IT!!!! However, the new teacher that Park has at Abney is WONDERFUL, and she has progressed beyond our wildest dreams and as far as we know, her program is staying where it is.

 

The goal for her this year was to speak consistently in complete sentences and she has achieved that goal thanks to her talented and dedicated teacher.

 

IMO, these students need the most structure and sameness in their everyday schedules. It's ridiculous that they're the ones moved on a whim.

 

 

Now that is what I'm thinking.:drinks:

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IMO, these students need the most structure and sameness in their everyday schedules. It's ridiculous that they're the ones moved on a whim.

 

Hmmm, you bring up a very good point! I wonder if thatcould be written in the IEP. They would have to do it, since the IEP is a legal contract.

 

Just a thought....

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Mr. Dis I have a daughter who has a 504 plan who has ADD. Her teachers isnt doing what is in the 504 Plan. I hope you can keep him where hes happy. Its took me all year for the 504 Plan. they should have known something when my 7th grader was only on a 5th grade level. Good Luck.

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Dis jr. was in dedicated small group at the regional school (Nebo). He had a teacher that was at Inner Harbor for years and the assistant who had years at Deveroux. That is what is crazy. Both SHOULD have been able to cover his needs and UNDERSTAND his sensory issues WITHOUT going to DFACS and not discussing them with me. Now he is at NHEC which currently is a dedicated school program from the hard to handle students. So he is in the most restrictive environment as far as the school goes but has the most flexability in his daily program with the better trained teachers.

 

 

 

 

Now that is what I'm thinking.:drinks:

 

I typed out a long response, I will PM it instead. You do have teachers from Nebo on this board!! No reason for you to display your hand to them.

Edited by overit
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Well, I know a ton about special education and I will tell you this....the courts have ruled time and time again that the IEP guarantees placement, not location. That's what they're betting on here. However, if you can prove that a particular location is detrimental to your child, then it's a game changer. I can recommend an advocate who causes me to cringe every time I hear her name....because she's good....but you'll pay. IF it were me, I'd start by requesting a copy of my parental rights. This will get someone's attention. Then I would read them. If you find a violation, file a grievance with the state dept of education. This is outlined in the parental rights packet. Read the section on "notice" and "participation" .... There might be a violation in there somewhere. I'd get on this pronto. I don't know what the summer schedule is like and you don't want to delay this too long, I'll also add that the school to which you are unhappy with has quite the reputation in the county. There might be a support group meeting at a local bar.

 

I just want to say...I wish ALL ESEP teachers cared about their children's success like you do! Can we just clone you?

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Hmmm, you bring up a very good point! I wonder if thatcould be written in the IEP. They would have to do it, since the IEP is a legal contract.

 

Just a thought....

 

If it is written in the IEP, they must do it. I taught sped in middle school in Cobb. I had a student who passed any test that was read to her. I pu in her IEP that her tests were to be read to her the following year. Her mom called me at my new school the next year. Lisa was failing everything and her mom was in tears.

I asked if they were reading the test questions to Lisa. No. Check your copy of the IEP and take it to them. She made As for the rest of the year! Smart, hardworking kid and they were ignoring her accommodations completely. Makes me furious.

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If it is written in the IEP, they must do it. I taught sped in middle school in Cobb. I had a student who passed any test that was read to her. I pu in her IEP that her tests were to be read to her the following year. Her mom called me at my new school the next year. Lisa was failing everything and her mom was in tears.

I asked if they were reading the test questions to Lisa. No. Check your copy of the IEP and take it to them. She made As for the rest of the year! Smart, hardworking kid and they were ignoring her accommodations completely. Makes me furious.

 

I wish I had known that could have been done with my oldest.

He is that kid that knows the material, but you can't get him to write for anything. His teachers always said he knows the work, but he just doesn't seem to be able to translate it to paper. I did suggest that they read the test, and allow him to answer verbally. They said they couldn't do that.

 

This is one of the reason's I am hypervegenlent (sp) about my youngest son's IEP.

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But that would make too much sense.

Yea, weeeeell there's that!! How can things not be so clear to the people making the decisions? I guess they've never had a special needs kid and have no idea what the consequences can be with such drastic changes.

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My wife and I have been in your shoes as parents and me as a Special Ed teacher in Paulding County. Please contact me at bikersmurf@gmail.com and leave me your cell phone number so I know it is you calling. I really think I can give you good direction from both view points. You are not alone. There are many of us silently living in the darkness. No one understands unless they are living it, or have lived it. I hope you decide to communicate with me.

 

Don't respond to me here. This is my wife's account. I couldn't remember my password.

 

Randy

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1366246267[/url]' post='3791648']

I have no advice to give, I just hope you get it figured out and he gets to stay at the school that helps him thrive. I know if I were you I would be very upset. My son has a lot of sensory issues, I worry a lot about him starting school.

 

ETA- I do know that when the time comes for my child to go to school, I will listen to any advice that WFAL has to give.

 

That means a lot. I love what I do and advocating for my kids is high priority....but I also know who feeds my biological kids. It's a tough row to how, but I make it work.

1366247992[/url]' post='3791659']

Check out "parents educating parents" They have a office in Douglasville and they are a non-profit advocate group. I got a lot done for my son 20 years ago at EPMS by just threatening the school with them. Good luck they will help you.

 

I have not had negative experiences with this group. They seem to genuinely have student's best interest in mind and are very interested in helping with compromise.

 

1366290063[/url]' post='3791720']

I just want to say...I wish ALL ESEP teachers cared about their children's success like you do! Can we just clone you?

 

When one find out they're having a baby, the don't hope for special needs. That's what drives me in meeting with parents......they don't ask for this...they just do the best they can. After exceptionally difficult meetings, I come hom and hug my kiddo and say a prayer of thanks.

 

 

1366300503[/url]' post='3791751']

^ I second this!

 

wub.gif

1366339318[/url]' post='3791958']

When is it closing? My granddaughter is going there over the summer to continue her IEP.

ESY is at NHEC this summer,

 

 

They're changing the use of the building. I think the poster of the comment meant that they're MOVING the programs housed there, not closing it.

 

 

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That means a lot. I love what I do and advocating for my kids is high priority....but I also know who feeds my biological kids. It's a tough row to how, but I make it work.

 

 

I have not had negative experiences with this group. They seem to genuinely have student's best interest in mind and are very interested in helping with compromise.

 

 

 

When one find out they're having a baby, the don't hope for special needs. That's what drives me in meeting with parents......they don't ask for this...they just do the best they can. After exceptionally difficult meetings, I come hom and hug my kiddo and say a prayer of thanks.

 

 

 

 

wub.gif

 

ESY is at NHEC this summer,

 

 

They're changing the use of the building. I think the poster of the comment meant that they're MOVING the programs housed there, not closing it.

 

I really appreciate your input here and our past conversations WFAL. I would also like to say thanks to all for all yoir input and suggestions. I am hoping he has a good year next year and that maybevhis current teacher goes to Nebo with him.

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That means a lot. I love what I do and advocating for my kids is high priority....but I also know who feeds my biological kids. It's a tough row to how, but I make it work.

 

 

I have not had negative experiences with this group. They seem to genuinely have student's best interest in mind and are very interested in helping with compromise.

 

 

 

When one find out they're having a baby, the don't hope for special needs. That's what drives me in meeting with parents......they don't ask for this...they just do the best they can. After exceptionally difficult meetings, I come hom and hug my kiddo and say a prayer of thanks.

 

 

 

 

wub.gif

 

ESY is at NHEC this summer,

 

 

They're changing the use of the building. I think the poster of the comment meant that they're MOVING the programs housed there, not closing it.

 

 

 

Thank you for that....because when the diagnosis comes in, the first thing we do is blame ourselves. What could I have done differently when pregnant or before pregnancy? We beat ourselves up first and some of us don't really get out of that phase.

 

THIS thread drove me to sit down with the Lead for the school system yesterday. It was completely last minute and my first time meeting her. While I am impressed with the progress my son has made, I AM THE REASON HE'S IN GENERAL ED. I am the one who didn't want to label him. I am the one who wanted him to have access to the inclusion program. I am the one who wanted him around "normal" kids. The teachers bent to my wishes and adjusted my sons needs according to MY demands...even though I'm thinking with my heart and not my brain. While this wasn't our official IEP meeting, we did go ahead and move ours up on the schedule so we can get my oldest in a better place for 4th grade. At this point, I don't want him going on with the inclusion class because I now care less about the label and more about his success. ALL I care about is whether or not he tries. He doesn't bother to try in the general ed because once he gets overwhelmed, he goes completely into himself and doesn't come back out. I've always measured success by effort, not by grades. I was very impressed with the time I was given, the fact that my wishes are heard, and the fact that they're doing everything they can to guarentee my son's success, now and in the future.

 

In the last 6 months, I have turned down TWO out of state jobs because I did not want to leave our program. That doesn't mean we'll be here for middle school....I haven't made that decision yet. But we are staying now and the number one reason is Allgood.

 

Dis, good luck to you. Thank you for your posts and for everyone else's input. Thank you WFAL for your input as well. While some of us may not have the experience yet, YOUR experience helps us to make better decisions.

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kudos for the heart change. It takes an open mind and large heart to move past that place you were in. I totally get that!! We ALL want the best for our children. It is my place as a parent to make sure that I set my child up for success. If that takes making a few adjustment to meet them where they are, then so be it. Lift them up. This will allow them to succeed, become more self confident and willing to take on challenges if they are not constantly faced with dread and disappointment. I have to be more vigilant and a lot more involved but if it takes that, I am willing. It's my job, I'm mom. I want my child to be the best that they can be! I know I probably drive the teachers crazy but they do know that if they call me, I'm there. Willing to sit down with my kid at night to make sure they have their homework, they really *get* that math problem. I also have to ask the teachers to explain some stuff to me that I may not understand. We have narrowed down how my kid learns so most material is presented to her in a way that it's easier for her to understand. When they have change teachers, you end up teaching the teacher how to teach your kid....that isn't so hard when you've been involved and know what and how the current teachers are teaching. Everybody is on the same page.

 

It's not an easy road but nobody said that parenting was easy. Easier for some, harder for some. Mine is not easy but it could be a lot harder. I am thankful for staff that I don't have to fight against. I am thankful that my child can learn even if it's hard for her. I figure that just makes me a more patient person, and hopefully her a harder worker.

 

All you can do is your best. :wub:

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Mr. Dis, you have gotten some great info! Best

of luck to you and your son. Sounds like he's

ahead of the game with you as his advocate.

 

Majic Mommy, I so admire your honesty and the

change of heart that you had! Your so right in the fact that

we moms always wonder if we did something wrong.

 

Crown App, you could not have stated that better!

I am sobbing after having read yours and Majic

Mommys posts.

 

My older son struggles and it is so hard to watch him and not knowing exactly

how to help sometimes. Thank God for everyone who has

Given me advice and guidance along the way.

I am so proud of him.

He has worked hard and through that

hard work and determination, is right on track and

exactly where he should be. You have to advocate

for your child, so very important. I have been blessed

with educators who have helped my son

He would not have reached his potential without

their help.

 

WFAL, I have stated before and agree wholeheartedly

with the others who think your amazing!!!

 

Dis, again, I wish you, your family and Dis jr.

the best. :)

 

Dang it's hard posting from my phone, sorry if its a

hot mess, lol.

Edited by dana
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That means a lot. I love what I do and advocating for my kids is high priority....but I also know who feeds my biological kids. It's a tough row to how, but I make it work.

 

 

I have not had negative experiences with this group. They seem to genuinely have student's best interest in mind and are very interested in helping with compromise.

 

 

 

When one find out they're having a baby, the don't hope for special needs. That's what drives me in meeting with parents......they don't ask for this...they just do the best they can. After exceptionally difficult meetings, I come hom and hug my kiddo and say a prayer of thanks.

 

 

 

 

wub.gif

 

ESY is at NHEC this summer,

 

 

They're changing the use of the building. I think the poster of the comment meant that they're MOVING the programs housed there, not closing it.

Thank you.

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