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Stock market closes -512.76 POINTS

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The stock market just closed at Minus 512.76 this is the lowest is has closed since 2008!!!! And that is without the unemployment report for tomorrow.

 

 

If this is better, I sure would hate to see worse.

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If this is better, I sure would hate to see worse.

 

Got to second that..........now everyone is waiting to see what the Asian markets are going to go in a couple of hours......Guess the outlook for unemployment and jobs isn't going to change any time soon. So much for the great stand off for the increase in the debt limit..........and we have that to look forward to AGAIN before Thanksgiving when the BIG 12 make their recommendations for the cuts in the budget.

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The Dow has dropped 800 points since the "debt limit" was raised, on the pretext that if the "debt limit" was not raised the stock market would plummet?

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Guest Hi~ho Silver

The Dow has dropped 800 points since the "debt limit" was raised, on the pretext that if the "debt limit" was not raised the stock market would plummet?

Kind of like....If we don't pass the stimulus bill, unemployment will be over 8%.

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I've been saying for 2 years the economy is going to tank. It has been apparent. I would have loved to be wrong but folks it's not getting better anytime soon.

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The stock market just closed at Minus 512.76 this is the lowest is has closed since 2008!!!! And that is without the unemployment report for tomorrow.

 

If the unemployment report comes out tomorrow, then the decline was in advance of the news, the details of which were likely leaked for the right sum of money.

 

For those who believe in pure capitalism, anything is for sale. Anything.

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The Dow has dropped 800 points since the "debt limit" was raised, on the pretext that if the "debt limit" was not raised the stock market would plummet?

 

 

I don't think it has anything to do with the debt limit.

 

It's all the other indicators that have come out so much worse than expected by the market.

 

Of course those of us living in this recession - making half of what we used to, watching fuel and food consuming more of our tight budget have been preaching to the choir for years now.

 

Where is former member to blow more smoke up our posteriors about how we have been out of the recession since 2009?

 

I will admit this looks like the second dip of what many of us predicted way back when... of a double dip.

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I don't think it has anything to do with the debt limit.

 

It's all the other indicators that have come out so much worse than expected by the market.

 

Of course those of us living in this recession - making half of what we used to, watching fuel and food consuming more of our tight budget have been preaching to the choir for years now.

 

Where is former member to blow more smoke up our posteriors about how we have been out of the recession since 2009?

 

I will admit this looks like the second dip of what many of us predicted way back when... of a double dip.

 

A +10 for you.:drinks:

 

I just heard a Liberal try to defend the "double dip" by saying we just have never really come out of the first one so it can't be a "double dip". Then my question to them would be what about the recovery summer stuff and "he got us out of the recession" comments? You can't argue this from both sides.

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on a possitive note, crude closed at $86.63 a barrel, down $5.30, or 5.77%. Wonder how long that will take to show at the pumps?

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A +10 for you.:drinks:

 

I just heard a Liberal try to defend the "double dip" by saying we just have never really come out of the first one so it can't be a "double dip". Then my question to them would be what about the recovery summer stuff and "he got us out of the recession" comments? You can't argue this from both sides.

 

Not a liberal, but I'll defend the "double dip" and say that's not what's not happening at all.

 

Whats happening is we've been slowly entering a full blown depression here in the states, which is beginning to accelerate, with the rest of the western world to follow us down into in short order.

 

China will weather it best and become the biggest super-power in the new economy to come out of this while the rest of the world slides into 3rd world status.

You have to wonder why they've been pouring billions into SE Asia and African countries as of late to boost those infrastructures.

 

on a possitive note, crude closed at $86.63 a barrel, down $5.30, or 5.77%. Wonder how long that will take to show at the pumps?

 

Longer than it'll take Opec to temporarily ease down exports (or at least announce it) to drive the prices back up so we barely notice a dip in what we pay.

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The answer to getting out of debt is not spending or increasing debt...it's cutting.

 

Around my house when we can't pay all our bills that month, we don't borrow more, we stop spending on things that aren't as important or that are waste.

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The answer to getting out of debt is not spending or increasing debt...it's cutting.

 

Around my house when we can't pay all our bills that month, we don't borrow more, we stop spending on things that aren't as important or that are waste.

 

Yes, but you live by the rules of common sense. Tim Geithner and his boss, P-BO, have no common sense.

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The answer to getting out of debt is not spending or increasing debt...it's cutting.

 

Around my house when we can't pay all our bills that month, we don't borrow more, we stop spending on things that aren't as important or that are waste.

 

 

To bad I can't give you a +1000.

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Yep, full blown depression is what's coming. My grandpa told me back in 2007 when housing started to burst, that is what happened in the Great Depression and he said it will get that bad again. He was right on. I am kinda lucky in that we are used to being broke so it's not going to be a culture shock with our family like it will with the people used to living in excess. The USA as we know it is going to 'change' alright. At least Obama got that part right.

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Two security guards were hired specifically as night watchmen at a museum to guard the priceless treasures on display.

 

Over the course of the night the two guards became unenamored with each others way of guarding the jewels, and began a debate.

The debate soon turned into a heated argument over the best tactics to use to keep said treasures best guarded.

 

At the end of their shift, as the sun arose, they looked around and realized the treasures were stolen right from under the noses.

 

The point being..

One of the Guards was a Liberal

The other a conservative

And the treasure..

 

Well that was the American Dream.

 

The thief?

Well that doesn't matter really when it all comes down to who can best win the argument.

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The answer to getting out of debt is not spending or increasing debt...it's cutting.

 

Around my house when we can't pay all our bills that month, we don't borrow more, we stop spending on things that aren't as important or that are waste.

 

I would disagree with the analogy.

 

When we keep cutting back on the hours that produce the income (taxes) and yet the bills keep going up because of required payments (costs go up every year), we should absolutely cut back on the spending. But there comes a point where working part time is not going to cover a full time worth of bills.

 

The answer is to start working more hours or get a second job if cutting back any more means no more groceries or electricity or medical care.

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Two security guards were hired specifically as night watchmen at a museum to guard the priceless treasures on display.

 

Over the course of the night the two guards became unenamored with each others way of guarding the jewels, and began a debate.

The debate soon turned into a heated argument over the best tactics to use to keep said treasures best guarded.

 

At the end of their shift, as the sun arose, they looked around and realized the treasures were stolen right from under the noses.

 

The point being..

One of the Guards was a Liberal

The other a conservative

And the treasure..

 

Well that was the American Dream.

 

The thief?

Well that doesn't matter really when it all comes down to who can best win the argument.

 

I could probably agree with that, but the problem is that the 'other' was actually a REPUBLICAN who knew nothing about being a Conservative.

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I could probably agree with that, but the problem is that the 'other' was actually a REPUBLICAN who knew nothing about being a Conservative.

 

I would agree with it too except for far too long "Republicans" have been calling themselves conservative. ;)

 

At this juncture I think we couldn't do any worse if we had Bonzo the Chimp as our commander in chief, having run on his "Does it really make a Damn?" ticket.

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How do I tell my kids it will get better when as an adult I do not see it getting better anytime soon.

 

What did your parents say in 1982 when we were in a very similar situation to what we're in now, with high unemployment and government spending going through the roof to unprecedented levels?

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on a possitive note, crude closed at $86.63 a barrel, down $5.30, or 5.77%. Wonder how long that will take to show at the pumps?

Well in about 3 weeks it will drop 3 cents for 12 hours right before the barrel price goes up and raises it 12 cents :mellow:

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Yes, but you live by the rules of common sense. Tim Geithner and his boss, P-BO, have no common sense.

 

 

To bad I can't give you a +1000.

 

 

Someone gave y'all negatives... I just used all mine up giving y'all some positives.... :ninja:

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Just my humble opinion.....

 

This was a mass liquidation for cash. Every index and commodity was off when I checked mid morning with the exception of cocoa.. go figure.. With Europe going from bad to worse, the DYX spiking up and the BOJ intervening in YEN/USD in the last 24 hours it may have caught some of the big boys off guard... Looks like someone may have had to cover the losing derivative position... especially on the yen carry trade...

Edited by winston1972

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The most valuable commodity when a recession hits isn't gold or silver, believe it or not, it's liquor. Folks who drink will do whatever it takes to get boozed up. They've been known to pawn their wedding rings, use the kids' lunch money or even let the rent wait an extra few days. Sadly, the liquor business is booming right now. When folks hit hard times, they tend to hit the bottle.

 

Anyone want to dust off their grandpa's still? just sayin'

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The Dow has dropped 800 points since the "debt limit" was raised, on the pretext that if the "debt limit" was not raised the stock market would plummet?

 

 

Correction...the Dow has dropped 800 points since the American government said they were going to pull $1,000,000,000000 out of an already struggling economy over the next year. When you own a business and your largest customer decides to rein in his spending, that typically doesn't bode well for your business.

 

With that said, the other guy above is right...there have been many indicators pointing to this for a while. It appears Wall Street has come to believe those indicators weren't lying.

 

 

mrnn

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Kind of like....If we don't pass the stimulus bill, unemployment will be over 8%.

Right.

 

Look at these three things:

 

Two days after the "debt limit" was raised to prevent the markets from going into a free-fall, and the DOW and has lost 800 points?

 

Two years after "comprehensive health care" was passed to keep health care cost down, and my health care insurance premiums have gone up $400 a month!

 

Three years after the "stimulus bill" was passed to prevent unemployment going above 8% and the unemployment is 9.7%!

 

Do you see a pattern?

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What did your parents say in 1982 when we were in a very similar situation to what we're in now, with high unemployment and government spending going through the roof to unprecedented levels?

I was married, trying to make ends meet, and paying a mortgage with 17% interest. We just hoped that the idiot in the White House would get out soon and someone with some common sense got in there. And it happened.

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Correction...the Dow has dropped 800 points since the American government said they were going to pull $1,000,000,000000 out of an already struggling economy over the next year. When you own a business and your largest customer decides to rein in his spending, that typically doesn't bode well for your business.

 

With that said, the other guy above is right...there have been many indicators pointing to this for a while. It appears Wall Street has come to believe those indicators weren't lying.

 

 

mrnn

The only problem with that "pulling $1,000,000,000,000" out of the already struggling economy is that they are still going to use Baseline Budgeting, which already autoamtically includes an 8% increase each year in spending so that "bug cut" won't be anything at all. It was all a scheme in order to get this debt ceiling raised through to the end of BHO term in 2012.

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What did your parents say in 1982 when we were in a very similar situation to what we're in now, with high unemployment and government spending going through the roof to unprecedented levels?

 

Good question.

 

In '82 we had a president who went to the airwaves and picked the American people up out of despair. He spoke of the strength and resiliency of the American economy; he gave them real hope and inspired them to begin returning to a more normal lifestyle.

 

He then backed up his words by demonstrating strong leadership. He convinced both parties to cut marginal tax rates, which lessened the burden on the people and let them keep more of their money, much of which went directly into the economy. He reduced excessive regulation which took some of the chains off of business. These things created jobs and also nearly doubled tax revenues in his eight years. His deal with congress also included heavy spending cuts; but the Democratic leadership didn't keep that end of the bargain.

 

Contrast that with the current resident of the White House. A president who seizes on every possible tragedy instead of bringing a positive message to the people. A president terribly short on experience; knowing only dangerous economic theories he learned from his liberal professors and advisers. Economic theories that have failed every time they've been tried, and have almost destroyed other countries in recent years. A president to is so terribly arrogant it's his way or the highway. A president who surrounds himself with staff and advisers who are equally unqualified. A president who has helped to put this country much further in debt than it's ever been. A president who is so indecisive and weak in leadership, Panetta and Hillary had to give the order to take out bin Laden.

 

THAT is the difference between '82 and now. Then we had a true leader as president, now we have an utter failure.

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Hey hey, everyone calm down, it's all going to be okay..

 

Jersey Shore in Italy starts tonight.

 

:lol: :lol:

 

and the sad thing is that I'd rather watch that than watch the president or any political or news program since it seems like things won't ever turn around and get better.

 

Might as well watch some reliable idiots than waste time on an unreliable government.

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He convinced both parties to cut marginal tax rates, which lessened the burden on the people and let them keep more of their money, much of which went directly into the economy.

 

Was that before, after, or inbetween his 11 tax increases?

 

link

 

mrnn

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Was that before, after, or inbetween his 11 tax increases?

 

link

 

mrnn

The site you link to is a joke. It's loaded with inaccuracies and half-truths.

 

The tax cuts far exceeded the re-alignments that you are calling increases. Plus, the site blames Reagan for the bloated budget when it was congress that did it.

 

Try again, but stick to real facts instead of liberal propaganda.

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The site you link to is a joke. It's loaded with inaccuracies and half-truths.

 

The tax cuts far exceeded the re-alignments that you are calling increases. Plus, the site blames Reagan for the bloated budget when it was congress that did it.

 

Try again, but stick to real facts instead of liberal propaganda.

 

 

What's a credible source in your eyes? I'd like to know just so that I can go to that site and pull the same facts that say Reagan's administration raised taxes 11 times, grew government exponentially, and ran up enormous deficits.

 

mrnn

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What's a credible source in your eyes? I'd like to know just so that I can go to that site and pull the same facts that say Reagan's administration raised taxes 11 times, grew government exponentially, and ran up enormous deficits.

 

mrnn

 

One that tells the whole truth. Tax bills frequently shift things around from one place to another. That is what you're calling an increase, even though it was a net decrease in tax rates.

 

Reagan and Tip O'Neal made a deal; for every dollar of tax cuts there were to be 2 or 3 dollars (I forget the specifics) of spending cuts. Tip broke his promise, and congress increased spending. Aside from signing the annual budget to keep government from being shut down, what did Reagan have to do with increasing spending?. Apparently, you don't understand how government works. Perhaps you need to re-read the constitution to have a better understanding who in the federal government can spend money. Congress...the Democratically controlled congress, ran up the deficit, same as they have in the last 2.5 years.

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One that tells the whole truth. Tax bills frequently shift things around from one place to another. That is what you're calling an increase, even though it was a net decrease in tax rates.

 

Reagan and Tip O'Neal made a deal; for every dollar of tax cuts there were to be 2 or 3 dollars (I forget the specifics) of spending cuts. Tip broke his promise, and congress increased spending. Aside from signing the annual budget to keep government from being shut down, what did Reagan have to do with increasing spending?. Apparently, you don't understand how government works. Perhaps you need to re-read the constitution to have a better understanding who in the federal government can spend money. Congress...the Democratically controlled congress, ran up the deficit, same as they have in the last 2.5 years.

 

If it fits your version - no matter how twisted it is - it MUST be the truth. Gotcha.

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