[TabbyCat]

I don;t think the kids should get off with no consequence. Prank or not, what they did was ILLEGAL.

Under state law, that crime is a felony.

I don't find it reasonable to hang a felony around the neck of a 17-18 y/o kid for graffiti. I just don't think the life-long implications of being convicted of a felony rise to the level of THIS particular crime.

Punishment? HELL YES. A life-altering felony conviction?

No. I just don't think that's a reasonable punishment.

As others have said, in this thread (I think) and in the other one about this topic, most if not all of us did something stupid when we were that age. The only difference is that we didn't get caught.

They need to face consequences serious enough to recognize that what they did is ILLEGAL and that, by the grace of their age and inexperience with criminal offenses (I'm assuming here), they have to pay the piper for this criminal activity, but not to the point of destroying their prospects for the future. If anything, this is a teaching moment, but the lesson will be lost if there are few, no, or very lenient consequences.

But a felony conviction?

No. That just doesn't seem right in any way. Possession of illegal drugs under a certain amount or drinking and driving or speeding through a school zone are all misdemeanors, and they are much more dangerous to society at large and individuals specifically than engaging in indiscriminate graffiti.

JMHO

[Subby's Mower Repair]

TabbyCat, on 12 March 2012 - 11:42 PM, said:

I don;t think the kids should get off with no consequence. Prank or not, what they did was ILLEGAL.

Under state law, that crime is a felony.

I don't find it reasonable to hang a felony around the neck of a 17-18 y/o kid for graffiti. I just don't think the life-long implications of being convicted of a felony rise to the level of THIS particular crime.

Punishment? HELL YES. A life-altering felony conviction?

No. I just don't think that's a reasonable punishment.

As others have said, in this thread (I think) and in the other one about this topic, most if not all of us did something stupid when we were that age. The only difference is that we didn't get caught.

They need to face consequences serious enough to recognize that what they did is ILLEGAL and that, by the grace of their age and inexperience with criminal offenses (I'm assuming here), they have to pay the piper for this criminal activity, but not to the point of destroying their prospects for the future. If anything, this is a teaching moment, but the lesson will be lost if there are few, no, or very lenient consequences.

But a felony conviction?


No. That just doesn't seem right in any way. Possession of illegal drugs under a certain amount or drinking and driving or speeding through a school zone are all misdemeanors, and they are much more dangerous to society at large and individuals specifically than engaging in indiscriminate graffiti.

JMHO

Good post! A felony will ruin your life, keep you from getting a job and....well....ruin your life. I don't see how that can offer any incentive to a youngster. You basically put them in a position to survive the only way they can...illegally. Why not just tell them straight up, "sell dope! You aint eligible to get a real job and be a meaningful part of society".

Nice....really nice. Kids are dumb...should they be robbed of a chance of growing up because of something dumb they did? May as well take em out back and shoot 'em. For public safety reasons, ya know?

[Epiphany]

It amazes me that some people are saying, "It's paint, the PARENTS can pay for the damages" or "I'd make my kid pay me back".

As a parent, if my 18-yo kid damages someone's property, THEY get to pay for it. We're not talking about a 10-yo who broke the neighbor's window with a baseball!

This was not an "Oops! I didn't know that paint would stick to brick!" - this was PRE-MEDITATED.

Regardless if they knew that spray painting gov't property was a felony, they still knew that spray painting a building or a vehicle was WRONG.

If they didn't know it was wrong, why were they wearing black at 3am, parents didn't know where they were and scattered like flies when the cops showed up?

I'd like to hear from all of the parents (of the kids who were charged) in a few weeks/months if their little darling actually paid them back for the attorney fees, etc.

I wonder how many parents have a hard choice right now of, "Hire an attorney or keep a roof over my head for my other kids and keep food on the table"?

[Lady Raider]

Epiphany, on 13 March 2012 - 07:12 AM, said:

It amazes me that some people are saying, "It's paint, the PARENTS can pay for the damages" or "I'd make my kid pay me back".

As a parent, if my 18-yo kid damages someone's property, THEY get to pay for it. We're not talking about a 10-yo who broke the neighbor's window with a baseball!

This was not an "Oops! I didn't know that paint would stick to brick!" - this was PRE-MEDITATED.

Regardless if they knew that spray painting gov't property was a felony, they still knew that spray painting a building or a vehicle was WRONG.

If they didn't know it was wrong, why were they wearing black at 3am, parents didn't know where they were and scattered like flies when the cops showed up?

I'd like to hear from all of the parents (of the kids who were charged) in a few weeks/months if their little darling actually paid them back for the attorney fees, etc.

I wonder how many parents have a hard choice right now of, "Hire an attorney or keep a roof over my head for my other kids and keep food on the table"?

I agree with this... The way people in general are struggling right now just to pay bills, and the way the BOE says we are hurting for money... this will take money that was needed else were rather it be from the BOE are struggling parents... and i do think the kids that ran from the police that night, (which is what the officer said on the news they did run from them) has a lot to do with some of the anger that is being shown. they knew it was wrong when they planned it, but to run from the law makes it worse..

[DonBrownJr]

Burn their rear ends, but I do think a felony is a bit much. My biggest concern is that all receive equal punishment. Some will probably not have parents who can pay for the damages, or hire lawyers. The punishment should be set as a group, and the fines or restitution requirements should be as a group.

I'm sure it won't work that way, but it should! Everyone involved knew it was illegal, and I doubt any of them just happened to wonder by the school at that time of night.

[LPPT]

DonBrownJr, on 13 March 2012 - 07:53 AM, said:

Burn their rear ends, but I do think a felony is a bit much. My biggest concern is that all receive equal punishment. Some will probably not have parents who can pay for the damages, or hire lawyers. The punishment should be set as a group, and the fines or restitution requirements should be as a group.

I'm sure it won't work that way, but it should! Everyone involved knew it was illegal, and I doubt any of them just happened to wonder by the school at that time of night.

I just wrote in the other thread that they should be given a choice of taking a misdemeanor knowing exactly what the punishment will be or fighting a felony charge.

[mysterious]

Subby, on 12 March 2012 - 11:01 PM, said:

For the record, although I may get my kid outa jail, it sure as hell wont be followed with a slap on the wrist.

Exactly.
Get them out of jail and be their PARENT.

We as parents need to take back the job of raising and punishing our kids.

Make them pay it back not only to their family, but also to society.

But do not let them stay in "the system".

[Captain Rhett Butler]

The girl who snitched will probably lose a lot of friends over this. Word has it she's being harassed at school and even got so upset she checked out of school early because several classmates were talking junk to her.

[brown*eyed*girl]

I picked the first choice. We don't have money but I would do what I could to have my child represented to the best of our abilities. I would not let my child spend the night in jail if I could help it (the OP stated this was a good kid who had never gotten in trouble).

I know this is extreme but when I was in the 5th grade we had a period of time when we got the city paper (this was in Grand Rapids, MI) and had to go through it doing various assignments and a few of the stories I read have stuck with me. One of which involved a teen boy whose parent decided to teach him a lesson by having him spend the night in jail after getting caught drinking or doing something else stupid. I think his friends parents came and got them out. I wish I could remember the details but I remember thinking the parent was someone impressive, of course as a 5th grader that could of meant a variety of titles. Anyways, he was beaten up and killed. I know this is so incredibly unlikely to happen but it made such an impression on me that I swore I would never let a friend or child (teen) spend a night in jail. I have never really thought about it but it might be part of the reason I was such a goody two shoes when I was younger. Well, that and as a teen I thought I was going to grow up to be a pastor or politician's wife and I didn't want to have anything in my past that would embarrass them.

[LPPT]

Captain Rhett Butler, on 13 March 2012 - 06:27 PM, said:

The girl who snitched will probably lose a lot of friends over this. Word has it she's being harassed at school and even got so upset she checked out of school early because several classmates were talking junk to her.

I feel sorry that she is going through this, but on the other hand it will build character.
I have been thinking about this a lot as many have.
We all know people that always for whatever reason come out smelling like a rose no matter how bad they behave.
I was never one of those people as a kid and even an adult. I seemed to get caught at everything I did, and even seemed to suffer the worse consequences whether other kids caught at the same thing did.

When I was in 2nd grade all the kids would swipe chalk from school and write on the side walks. Of course I got caught by the teacher, I can still feel the shame to this day.

Getting caught taught me to not do the wrong thing, I just accepted that I would never get away with doing wrong, it made me a better person. I guess for some it inspires them to try harder not to get caught.

This girl did the right thing, she put her family first and now others have to share the burden and rightfully so.
I hope that this builds character for many of these kids.

I realize now as an adult that I was being blessed by what seemed to be just bad luck.

[gog8tors]

Captain Rhett Butler, on 13 March 2012 - 06:27 PM, said:

The girl who snitched will probably lose a lot of friends fake friends over this. Word has it she's being harassed at school and even got so upset she checked out of school early because several classmates were talking junk to her.

Well at least she knows who her true friends are.

[dana]

gog8tors, on 20 March 2012 - 04:36 PM, said:

Well at least she knows who her true friends are.

true...

[dallasladybug]

mrnn, on 12 March 2012 - 09:52 AM, said:

I can nearly guarantee you that 95% of these kids had no idea that what they were doing qualified for a felony charge nor what the full extent of the consequences of a felony record entails.

mrnn

I agree they weren't thinking of what the charges were, and that they might get caught. I know this year went too far, but the school area has been spray painted Many years before this one.Again I know they painted more than just the road... I think that show on t.v about school pranks is encouraging kids to do more than what we used too.

[gibsonbabyicon]

I think they should be punished but I do not think that this warranted a felony. It got out of hand and the kids should have been put to cleaning up all of what the messed up and at least 500 hrs of community service cleaning up graffiti from else where. I'm sure that most of them are remorseful of what happened. I don't think they should lose scholarships or admissions to schools because of it. I know college students and grad students who have done way worse than these misguided youths and have gotten away with it. A felony is gonna destroy lives. They should be punished, yes, but their lives shouldnt be totally destroyed.

[Inspector Callahan]

Instead of spending money on Attorneys and worried about felony charges, I wonder how many parents have stepped up to say they would pony up the cost to repair the damage. We're talking, what $500 or so bucks per hoodie? The parents should (but most wouldn't) make their little vandals pay it back. I would more inclined to reduce charges if I didn't have to pay for the damage, as a taxpayer. Still, there would be consequences, but not felony level.

This post has been edited by Inspector Callahan: 31 March 2012 - 09:02 PM

[MeWhoElse]

Inspector Callahan, on 31 March 2012 - 09:01 PM, said:

Instead of spending money on Attorneys and worried about felony charges, I wonder how many parents have stepped up to say they would pony up the cost to repair the damage. We're talking, what $500 or so bucks per hoodie? The parents should (but most wouldn't) make their little vandals pay it back. I would more inclined to reduce charges if I didn't have to pay for the damage, as a taxpayer. Still, there would be consequences, but not felony level.

That is what restitution is for and will be handled in court. Why put the cart before the horse?

[KRM]

I am tired of reading this thread. Yes, I think the kids should pay (clean and pay a fine) for what they did. FELONY? Hell no. These are teens who have been told of their predecessors pranks. They want to remember their Senior year with memories THEY made. Were they wrong? Yes. Should they be expelled? No, I just don't believe so. Would I help my kid if she did this? You bet your sweet ass I would. To NEVER have been in trouble and then this would not make me just kick my kid to the proverbial curb. Suspension, which was what at least one originally got, is fair. Expulsion, not so much.

[rockysmom]

MeWhoElse, on 02 April 2012 - 05:06 PM, said:

That is what restitution is for and will be handled in court. Why put the cart before the horse?

Hey girlie girl! BTW, STILL love the ant.

[Inspector Callahan]

MeWhoElse, on 02 April 2012 - 05:06 PM, said:

That is what restitution is for and will be handled in court. Why put the cart before the horse?

Not in my book. You trash it, you fix it. Or you can pay to have the damage repaired. Personal responsibility, what a concept! Then you can deal with the rest of it.

[MeWhoElse]

Inspector Callahan, on 02 April 2012 - 08:30 PM, said:

Not in my book. You trash it, you fix it. Or you can pay to have the damage repaired. Personal responsibility, what a concept! Then you can deal with the rest of it.

Oh they will pay, when the time comes...

[Subby's Mower Repair]

KRM, on 02 April 2012 - 06:26 PM, said:

I am tired of reading this thread. Yes, I think the kids should pay (clean and pay a fine) for what they did. FELONY? Hell no. These are teens who have been told of their predecessors pranks. They want to remember their Senior year with memories THEY made. Were they wrong? Yes. Should they be expelled? No, I just don't believe so. Would I help my kid if she did this? You bet your sweet ass I would. To NEVER have been in trouble and then this would not make me just kick my kid to the proverbial curb. Suspension, which was what at least one originally got, is fair. Expulsion, not so much.

I, too, am tired of the thread. Punishment? YES!! Felony....absurd. To stamp young teens with that is counterproductive...you ruin their chance at being a fruitful citizen. But I am all too familiar with people who would just as soon lynch them without a trial, not understanding the impact of what a felony charge will do to destroy a young life. God help us all and save our kids from draconian (and IMO, emotionally detached) people who simply do not understand the err of their thinking.

[A Gipper Girl]

tbird, on 12 March 2012 - 09:18 AM, said:

Ok,, Been there, done that.

Yes, many years ago, my son got in trouble and was arrested--nothing major, just stupid kid stuff. Did I get him out--yes. Did he pay me back--yes. And he paid for his own attorney (this was before I started working for attorneys and we found one that would allow HIM to make payments). He took his punishment and went on with his life.

One thing I learned amny moons ago was--NEVER say that your kid won't do something!!! It will most likely come back and bite you in the A$!! Even the best of kids will do things with their friends that you never dreamed of. And I would venture to say that even your "best kid" has done something in their life that their parents know nothing about.

I have learned the same thing. You are so right and handled it great, IMO. I think I would have handled it much the same way. I DO believe in kids having to pay the consequences but "young and dumb" applies, too. I think you just have to weigh it out by the child and the situation.

[A Gipper Girl]

Subby, on 03 April 2012 - 12:59 AM, said:

I, too, am tired of the thread. Punishment? YES!! Felony....absurd. To stamp young teens with that is counterproductive...you ruin their chance at being a fruitful citizen. But I am all too familiar with people who would just as soon lynch them without a trial, not understanding the impact of what a felony charge will do to destroy a young life. God help us all and save our kids from draconian (and IMO, emotionally detached) people who simply do not understand the err of their thinking.

AGREED! I always HATE to hear of a teen/child slapped with a felony and even worse, a life sentence. I am in no way making excuses for their actions but at that point in life so much is happening and bad choices are made based on emotion, hormones, abusive childhood, etc. I know sometimes it HAS to happen that way but I hate it when it does. Seems like such a waste.