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dumbestgirlintheworld

OK, Now I'm Afraid

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Everything I read sounds like we're headed for DOOM. :sigh:

 

Edited to add that your avatar is the Doomiest of All. :D

Edited by mei lan

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We're down 300 points a day - "technically" a crash.

 

Anyone else fearing the worst?

 

I'm trying very hard to not look. I will not look, I will not read, I will not look, I will not read, I will not look, I will not read.......................

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We're down 300 points a day - "technically" a crash.

 

Anyone else fearing the worst?

 

 

I've been fearing the worst for the past two years and so far those fears are ringing true. Part of my retirement is in the market, although I'm retired I don't need it for a while, just have to ride it out and hope things turn around.

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I've had that feeling for a long time......I was hoping it would go away....but not looking to good right now.......my heart sunk when I saw the headlines this morning.....

 

That little light at the end of the tunnel really is going OFF....FOR GOOD....

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What you're basically seeing here is investors casting a "no confidence vote" in our government.

 

Take that as you will, but things have to change.

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We're down 300 points a day - "technically" a crash.

 

Anyone else fearing the worst?

 

 

 

sooooo, buy your stocks short and make money on the way down

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What you're basically seeing here is investors casting a "no confidence vote" in our government.

 

Take that as you will, but things have to change.

 

 

This....

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I buy ammo.

Ditto

 

And this is why I need to know where you live. I'm stocking up the MRE's, you have the ammo, we'll put a cache somewhere between here and Montana and we'll be all set for the zombie apocolypse.

I've gotten several case so far as well. I pick them up when ever I see a good deal.

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Don't be surprised if you start hearing a new phrase bandied about on the "talking head" news shows here soon.

 

It's "Peak Employment", and will likely become the topic de jour for the next few years as we'll officially have 7 billion people on the planet by October of this year.

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Sorry, but I would welcome a crash. Last time we made out like a bandit. For the past year we have been "stable"

 

Come on....throw the eggs.

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What you're basically seeing here is investors casting a "no confidence vote" in our government.

 

Take that as you will, but things have to change.

Yep.

 

Until there are jobs and people purchasing goods the market will struggle.

 

That being said, until businesses see a government that will not punish them for success- there will not be expansion of those businesses and more jobs. They will sit on their cash where it is safe.

 

People will not be spending money on goods- there will be a contraction of spending ... once again the numbers will come out (as they did this week) scare people and the market will have a sell off.

 

Many of us predicted a double dip from the policies of this administration and this is what we are seeing right now. You can't spend your way out of a financial crisis, study what happened to Japan and their lost decade. (Going on three decades.)

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Yep.

 

Until there are jobs and people purchasing goods the market will struggle.

People will not be spending money on goods- there will be a contraction of spending ... once again the numbers will come out (as they did this week) scare people and the market will have a sell off.

 

I agree wholeheartedly with this.

 

That being said, until businesses see a government that will not punish them for success- there will not be expansion of those businesses and more jobs. They will sit on their cash where it is safe.

 

I'm having trouble parsing this. Small business, and on shore corps, are hurting all around, but large multi-national corporations are having the times of their lives, especially for those at the top of the companies. They're almost being rewarded seeing how many have built their companies to the point that they've become "too big to fail" and so on.

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I'm having trouble parsing this. Small business, and on shore corps, are hurting all around, but large multi-national corporations are having the times of their lives, especially for those at the top of the companies. They're almost being rewarded seeing how many have built their companies to the point that they've become "too big to fail" and so on.

 

If you have money in the bank, see an opportunity, however, you are uncertain what taxes, hurdles, and added cost that new regulations from the government will take from your potential profit - why risk it in the first place.

 

Companies are looking at uncertainty from this government. They take the risk with that capital, they might have made a profit with the regulations they were under when they began, however with the regulations changing they might lose money because the new regulations add cost.

 

Uncertainty kills job growth because businesses will not risk expansion.

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Don't be afraid be smart and start buying.

 

With what?

 

I don't know about you, but I had to take a significant salary decrease just to be employed.

 

I'm lucky to still add to retirement. Only to lose tens of thousands of dollars in days.

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If you have money in the bank, see an opportunity, however, you are uncertain what taxes, hurdles, and added cost that new regulations from the government will take from your potential profit - why risk it in the first place.

 

Companies are looking at uncertainty from this government. They take the risk with that capital, they might have made a profit with the regulations they were under when they began, however with the regulations changing they might lose money because the new regulations add cost.

 

Uncertainty kills job growth because businesses will not risk expansion.

 

Yeah but large multinationals don't have this concern. Lay off a few tens of thousands here, invest your monies saved over there, at the end of the quarter the sheets balance out, might be you even show a nice profit, investors are happy and everybody wins, except for the ex-employees that is.

 

I see the main problem as having become a catch-22 here in the States.

 

Heading for a bad quarter, lay off to balance your sheets.

More unemployed in the job market equals less purchasing power in the markets.

Jobs reports come out, show economy to be faltering, investors sell off and all that money saved by first round of lay offs is negated.

Company then looks to show profit on market losses.. so another round of layoffs to balance the sheets..

rinse.. repeat..

 

It's a cascade effect without a real end in sight until the markets really correct themselves.

 

The problem all began when these large corps decided to game the system and the system blew up because it could only be gamed for so long.

Our politicians decided they were too big to fail which basically broke the entire capitalistic system we have in place.

I mean if you cannot compete in the marketplace as it works now, then you shouldn't be playing.

 

And I do understand what you are saying and it does apply here in the states, but the playing field has become the entire world at this point, and if you're only playing here in the states, then well you bought the ticket, so ride the ride, and it's going to get bumpier before it gets better.

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Yeah but large multinationals don't have this concern. Lay off a few tens of thousands here, invest your monies saved over there, at the end of the quarter the sheets balance out, might be you even show a nice profit, investors are happy and everybody wins, except for the ex-employees that is.

 

I see the main problem as having become a catch-22 here in the States.

 

Heading for a bad quarter, lay off to balance your sheets.

More unemployed in the job market equals less purchasing power in the markets.

Jobs reports come out, show economy to be faltering, investors sell off and all that money saved by first round of lay offs is negated.

Company then looks to show profit on market losses.. so another round of layoffs to balance the sheets..

rinse.. repeat..

 

It's a cascade effect without a real end in sight until the markets really correct themselves.

 

The problem all began when these large corps decided to game the system and the system blew up because it could only be gamed for so long.

Our politicians decided they were too big to fail which basically broke the entire capitalistic system we have in place.

I mean if you cannot compete in the marketplace as it works now, then you shouldn't be playing.

 

And I do understand what you are saying and it does apply here in the states, but the playing field has become the entire world at this point, and if you're only playing here in the states, then well you bought the ticket, so ride the ride, and it's going to get bumpier before it gets better.

 

You're right. I'm working for a UK company and actually have more security then I've ever had as a result of their structures. It's damn near impossible to get fired in the UK.

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But I thought I heard them saying on the TV that the economy was turning around. The cuts from the debt ceiling bill only account for a few days worth of government spending so that won't have any effect on the economy. And we still have a democratic controlled Senate and Presidency that's supposed to be able to pull us out of the ditch.

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<snip>

the playing field has become the entire world at this point, and if you're only playing here in the states, then well you bought the ticket, so ride the ride, and it's going to get bumpier before it gets better.

As DGITW shared...Jobs are not here in the States ... companies are taking their marbles and playing the game elsewhere. No need to risk it here.

 

Many "experts" are saying as our college grads are looking for work, they might as well understand they will need to move to another country. The jobs are not here.

 

Do the math... what has our government done regulations wise to push corporations overseas?

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As DGITW shared...Jobs are not here in the States ... companies are taking their marbles and playing the game elsewhere. No need to risk it here.

 

Many "experts" are saying as our college grads are looking for work, they might as well understand they will need to move to another country. The jobs are not here.

 

Do the math... what has our government done regulations wise to push corporations overseas?

 

Companies don't NEED to move anywhere, they've chosen to do so in order to pay slave wages for slave labor so we have the choice of buying cheap crap made at either Chinese factory A or factory B.

 

The only thing our government has tried to do is hold certain entities accountable for their .. well.. accounting.. of the past decade that got us into this mess, then turn around and write them checks when they become near insolvent from the illusion of due diligence.

 

But when all you got left is to blame the left for 3 years of nothing much, just like the previous admin of 8 years.. and the one of 8 years before that.. etc..

Then you fail to grasp the root of the problem.

 

All I've seen is concessions to corporations to try to keep jobs here to varying, little, degrees of success.

 

But then again, the meme has become blame workers here in the US for wanting a fair wage for a fair days work, take away their "entitlements" and tax them more to try to correct the fact that the new CEO of the company needs a $1.5 billion sign on bonus for discovering a new way to pass the companies taxes onto the purchaser or not have to pay them at all.

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Companies don't NEED to move anywhere, they've chosen to do so in order to pay slave wages for slave labor so we have the choice of buying cheap crap made at either Chinese factory A or factory B.

 

The only thing our government has tried to do is hold certain entities accountable for their .. well.. accounting.. of the past decade that got us into this mess, then turn around and write them checks when they become near insolvent from the illusion of due diligence.

 

But when all you got left is to blame the left for 3 years of nothing much, just like the previous admin of 8 years.. and the one of 8 years before that.. etc..

Then you fail to grasp the root of the problem.

 

All I've seen is concessions to corporations to try to keep jobs here to varying, little, degrees of success.

 

But then again, the meme has become blame workers here in the US for wanting a fair wage for a fair days work, take away their "entitlements" and tax them more to try to correct the fact that the new CEO of the company needs a $1.5 billion sign on bonus for discovering a new way to pass the companies taxes onto the purchaser or not have to pay them at all.

 

For the most part I tend to agree but I have to ask. Exactly what part did a golfing supply company moving to Micronesia have to do with the accounting in a company that got us into this mess. then turn around and write them checks when they became near insolvent? I think your accusation is misdirected. The vast majority of US companies had nothing to do with what happened. It was OUR very own government and the financial and investment industries that got us into this and they are almost wholey staffed by workers right here in the states.

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Companies don't NEED to move anywhere, they've chosen to do so in order to pay slave wages for slave labor so we have the choice of buying cheap crap made at either Chinese factory A or factory B.

 

The only thing our government has tried to do is hold certain entities accountable for their .. well.. accounting.. of the past decade that got us into this mess, then turn around and write them checks when they become near insolvent from the illusion of due diligence.

 

But when all you got left is to blame the left for 3 years of nothing much, just like the previous admin of 8 years.. and the one of 8 years before that.. etc..

Then you fail to grasp the root of the problem.

 

All I've seen is concessions to corporations to try to keep jobs here to varying, little, degrees of success.

 

But then again, the meme has become blame workers here in the US for wanting a fair wage for a fair days work, take away their "entitlements" and tax them more to try to correct the fact that the new CEO of the company needs a $1.5 billion sign on bonus for discovering a new way to pass the companies taxes onto the purchaser or not have to pay them at all.

I did not say the companies NEED to move... I said… The "experts" are saying as our college grads are looking for work they might as well accept that THEY- the College Grad - will need to move to where the jobs are.

 

Many things are wrong here in the U.S.

 

We can look at ourselves personally too. How many took equity out of their home to buy a nice new car, furniture, or go on wonderful trips... when their credit cards were maxed out and they really could not afford the life they were living?

 

 

How many bought too much house with Zero down and an adjustable rate mortgage, because they could not afford the payments at a 5.5%?

 

We Americans have been living beyond our means for decades ...as has the government. Something has to change. It's going to hurt for a while... just as it did in the 70's, 80's and 90's - each excess bubble.

 

This decade we have blown up our national debt to a percentage of GDP we may not recover from ... on top of uncertainty for what other regulations and taxes this current administration will put on business.

 

Anyway you look at it there is HUGE uncertainty...and the stock market will not perform well in uncertainty.

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For the most part I tend to agree but I have to ask. Exactly what part did a golfing supply company moving to Micronesia have to do with the accounting in a company that got us into this mess. then turn around and write them checks when they became near insolvent? I think your accusation is misdirected. The vast majority of US companies had nothing to do with what happened. It was OUR very own government and the financial and investment industries that got us into this and they are almost wholey staffed by workers right here in the states.

 

Like I said, certain entities, which doesn't mean all companies as it relates to the financial market meltdown, but then again the juggernaut of off-shoring has been in full swing going on over a decade now.

As to why they got themselves a check, it probably all has to do with which politician favored their golfing supplies best. The US government is just the good ol' boy system we see everyday in paulding, only it's on a national scale.

 

But the vast majority of US companies did have something to do with some of the problems we now face, since they do tend to diversify and put their monies back into other stocks and play the same financial loopholes everyone else was doing.

 

The US is definitely becoming a welfare state, for the politicians and heads of large multinationals, screw everyone else because we seem to have zero problem with making more of us to fill in the gaps. And all we can bring ourselves to do is sit online and argue over how he said their party was going to "make it better" anymore.

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Like I said, certain entities, which doesn't mean all companies as it relates to the financial market meltdown, but then again the juggernaut of off-shoring has been in full swing going on over a decade now.

 

Off shoring jobs, Which I disagree with but understand, did not cause the meltdown.

As to why they got themselves a check, it probably all has to do with which politician favored their golfing supplies best. The US government is just the good ol' boy system we see everyday in paulding, only it's on a national scale.

 

But the vast majority of US companies did have something to do with some of the problems we now face, since they do tend to diversify and put their monies back into other stocks and play the same financial loopholes everyone else was doing.

 

And by that reasoning every American who owns stocks, bonds, mutual funds, has a retirement fund / account or any of a myriad of othe financial investments is JUST AS GUILTY as the business entities.

 

The US is definitely becoming a welfare state, for the politicians and heads of large multinationals, screw everyone else because we seem to have zero problem with making more of us to fill in the gaps. And all we can bring ourselves to do is sit online and argue over how he said their party was going to "make it better" anymore.

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The poultry industry was poised for a major expansion 2011/2012 which would have upped our exports substantially.

 

But the Government mandate on Ethanol has driven the price of corn to such ridiculous levels the companies which had started expanding have lost their ass the past 90 days trying to feed the chickens.

 

So instead we have 3 major producers who have undergone bankruptcy, and all have been sold. Townsend Farm's NC operations are in the process of being closed down. The tycoon from the Ukraine who bought them for $30million has decided to just cut his losses and shut it down. 1000 jobs lost in Siler City, NC; and 200 farmers who have lost their poultry contracts.

 

Pilgrim's posted a $125 million loss for the 2nd quarter and is cutting back 10%.

 

So instead of expanding, we are as of right now looking at cutting production numbers by 6%, if not more. Tyson and Pilgrims destroyed several million hatching eggs in the past 4 weeks. They pulled them out of the incubators and threw them in the garbage.

 

You cannot make fuel out of your number 1 feed grain and not expect to screw up the markets.

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I did not say the companies NEED to move... I said… The "experts" are saying as our college grads are looking for work they might as well accept that THEY- the College Grad - will need to move to where the jobs are.

I responded to the need to move comment made before the one about college grads. Higher education has become it's own racket here in the states. You really want to give your kids a good college education without the inflated price, move them to India to receive it for pennies of what we pay, then have them emigrate to another country that's paying the highest wages for their lines of work.

 

Many things are wrong here in the U.S.

 

Co-sign. (except I would add more many's to that)

 

We can look at ourselves personally too. How many took equity out of their home to buy a nice new car, furniture, or go on wonderful trips... when their credit cards were maxed out and they really could not afford the life they were living?

 

How many bought too much house with Zero down and an adjustable rate mortgage, because they could not afford the payments at a 5.5%?

 

We Americans have been living beyond our means for decades ...as has the government. Something has to change. It's going to hurt for a while... just as it did in the 70's, 80's and 90's - each excess bubble.

 

This decade we have blown up our national debt to a percentage of GDP we may not recover from ... on top of uncertainty for what other regulations and taxes this current administration will put on business.

 

Anyway you look at it there is HUGE uncertainty...and the stock market will not perform well in uncertainty.

 

You look to blame the consumer, I look to blame those that made the game.

The problem with the mortgage crisis went beyond picking the low hanging fruit and going after the rotten apples on the ground.

 

But lets be honest, I was born into a country where I was told I could attain the "American Dream" where if I work hard, then I get rewarded for my labors, and can help the next generations attain the dream as well, while having some sense of security in my old age. Unfortunately for everyone here that has been proven pretty much a barrel of bullcheese that we've all been lapping up for our lives as no-one is entitled to anything unless you are in the top 2% no matter how hard you work.

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You cannot make fuel out of your number 1 feed grain and not expect to screw up the markets.

 

This HAS to be one of THE stupidest gooberment actions EVER.

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Off shoring jobs, Which I disagree with but understand, did not cause the meltdown.

 

I didn't say that it caused the melt down. I was just replying to your comment of why a company who off-shored got government payment.

 

And by that reasoning every American who owns stocks, bonds, mutual funds, has a retirement fund / account or any of a myriad of the financial investments is JUST AS GUILTY as the business entities.

 

Sorry to say, but yes, when you did so you bought into a system of creative accounting that you were led to believe would turn your money into more money, don't be surprised if a thing that's setup to reward a small percentage doesn't reward you in return.

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Yep.

 

Until there are jobs and people purchasing goods the market will struggle.

 

That being said, until businesses see a government that will not punish them for success- there will not be expansion of those businesses and more jobs. They will sit on their cash where it is safe.

 

People will not be spending money on goods- there will be a contraction of spending ... once again the numbers will come out (as they did this week) scare people and the market will have a sell off.

 

Many of us predicted a double dip from the policies of this administration and this is what we are seeing right now. You can't spend your way out of a financial crisis, study what happened to Japan and their lost decade. (Going on three decades.)

 

Doesn't take much to "predict" a double dip since the severity of 2007-2009 compared to the Great Depression and there were several "dips" afterward. It is a given that it would happen and it had NOTHING to do with Obama.

 

Businesses got plenty of tax breaks and they didn't spend it to create jobs the last 10 years, so pull that argument.

 

Of course, your last "prediction" was way off so I expect this one to be as well. (Amazing what a search feature can find.) My Link

 

And where are those 22% interest rates you predicted? My Link

 

But I'm just riding this thing out. Don't care to even think about it. My husband handles it and I just leave it to him since it is all his 401k anyway.

Edited by zoocrew
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This mess has EVERYTHING to do with Obama. Although Bush did contribute into getting the US into this mess, the Left was confident that Obama would be able to get the US out of it by increasing the size of government and increasing spending exponentially. However, now even the Left has realized that Obama's policies - developed by those select individuals from academia who have never run a business, met a budget or managed a payroll - have not and will not work to bring this country out of this Depression. In ALL previous Recessions and Depressions, it has been Free Market Capitalism that has gotten this country out of those recessions - not the government by spending more.

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This mess has EVERYTHING to do with Obama. Although Bush did contribute into getting the US into this mess, the Left was confident that Obama would be able to get the US out of it by increasing the size of government and increasing spending exponentially. However, now even the Left has realized that Obama's policies - developed by those select individuals from academia who have never run a business, met a budget or managed a payroll - have not and will not work to bring this country out of this Depression. In ALL previous Recessions and Depressions, it has been Free Market Capitalism that has gotten this country out of those recessions - not the government by spending more.

 

I don't think so.

 

Who got the Prescription Drug Plan passed? Who got us into TWO wars? Who began the bailouts verses who continued the bailouts?

 

The point is the recession was so big and so bad that it required those extraordinary bailouts to keep the economy from complete collapse.

 

That's what I'm reading from a lot of sources and I think I will trust those in this area.

Edited by zoocrew

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